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	<title>Comments on: M&#8217;s lock up Lopez</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.ussmariner.com/2007/04/18/ms-lock-up-lopez/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.ussmariner.com/2007/04/18/ms-lock-up-lopez/</link>
	<description>Seattle Mariners blog and general baseball discussion</description>
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		<title>By: gwangung</title>
		<link>http://www.ussmariner.com/2007/04/18/ms-lock-up-lopez/comment-page-2/#comment-174158</link>
		<dc:creator>gwangung</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Apr 2007 05:08:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ussmariner.com/2007/04/18/ms-lock-up-lopez/#comment-174158</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;For one, I think Hargrove and the coaches messed him up too much by urging him to be a â€œmove him overâ€ hitter. Two, I really donâ€™t see much to indicate they are working to get Jose back to driving the ball to the alleys. As long as Grover is here, he isnâ€™t going to hurry to change Jose back.

&lt;/blockquote&gt;


Which is really, really stupid.

From even a fan&#039;s perspective, going the other way is a tool to ADD to your repertoire, not replace it. The only reason to preach going the other way is if you&#039;re not a good enough hitter to pull the ball and be productive.

Um, hello? For half a season, Lopez showed he COULD pull the ball and be productive. And he&#039;d only get better with age.

The current strategy is a dull, unimaginative one where players are coached to be what they should be doing, and totally ignores what a player DOES.

I&#039;ve said it before and I&#039;ll say it again...if Hargrove was managing Ichiro when he first came over, he would totally tried to change Ichiro&#039;s style....</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>For one, I think Hargrove and the coaches messed him up too much by urging him to be a â€œmove him overâ€ hitter. Two, I really donâ€™t see much to indicate they are working to get Jose back to driving the ball to the alleys. As long as Grover is here, he isnâ€™t going to hurry to change Jose back.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>Which is really, really stupid.</p>
<p>From even a fan&#8217;s perspective, going the other way is a tool to ADD to your repertoire, not replace it. The only reason to preach going the other way is if you&#8217;re not a good enough hitter to pull the ball and be productive.</p>
<p>Um, hello? For half a season, Lopez showed he COULD pull the ball and be productive. And he&#8217;d only get better with age.</p>
<p>The current strategy is a dull, unimaginative one where players are coached to be what they should be doing, and totally ignores what a player DOES.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve said it before and I&#8217;ll say it again&#8230;if Hargrove was managing Ichiro when he first came over, he would totally tried to change Ichiro&#8217;s style&#8230;.</p>
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		<title>By: kmsandrbs</title>
		<link>http://www.ussmariner.com/2007/04/18/ms-lock-up-lopez/comment-page-2/#comment-174141</link>
		<dc:creator>kmsandrbs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Apr 2007 04:48:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ussmariner.com/2007/04/18/ms-lock-up-lopez/#comment-174141</guid>
		<description>So, I think it would be great to get articles on signing Felix and Ichiro by the USSM quartet.

I&#039;d probably want the M&#039;s to work out a deal that covers arbitration years and gives them a team option for the first year of free agency.

I&#039;d like to think the M&#039;s would offer a slightly higher than normal offer, so that if Felix&#039;s ace ways continue, he is predisposed to return to the team. But, reality tells me that things don&#039;t work that way, in part because 1) the potential injury factor with young pitchers and 2) reliance on Felix seeing the &#039;goodwill&#039; gesture, which relies on him recognizing that the M&#039;s could probably get him for much less than he is worth over the next several years. They&#039;d probably be better off to sign Felix for the lowest amount possible, and then squirrel extra money away (the amount they &#039;would&#039; have paid) to offer as a nice big signing bonus if he returns in free-agency (and is still the ace pitcher). Of course, I don&#039;t think the M&#039;s will work this way either. I can only hope that they offer a reasonable salary, not for too long.

Given the potential ace status, I&#039;d also go slightly higher and try to get one or two team option years.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So, I think it would be great to get articles on signing Felix and Ichiro by the USSM quartet.</p>
<p>I&#8217;d probably want the M&#8217;s to work out a deal that covers arbitration years and gives them a team option for the first year of free agency.</p>
<p>I&#8217;d like to think the M&#8217;s would offer a slightly higher than normal offer, so that if Felix&#8217;s ace ways continue, he is predisposed to return to the team. But, reality tells me that things don&#8217;t work that way, in part because 1) the potential injury factor with young pitchers and 2) reliance on Felix seeing the &#8216;goodwill&#8217; gesture, which relies on him recognizing that the M&#8217;s could probably get him for much less than he is worth over the next several years. They&#8217;d probably be better off to sign Felix for the lowest amount possible, and then squirrel extra money away (the amount they &#8216;would&#8217; have paid) to offer as a nice big signing bonus if he returns in free-agency (and is still the ace pitcher). Of course, I don&#8217;t think the M&#8217;s will work this way either. I can only hope that they offer a reasonable salary, not for too long.</p>
<p>Given the potential ace status, I&#8217;d also go slightly higher and try to get one or two team option years.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: atait</title>
		<link>http://www.ussmariner.com/2007/04/18/ms-lock-up-lopez/comment-page-2/#comment-174118</link>
		<dc:creator>atait</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Apr 2007 03:08:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ussmariner.com/2007/04/18/ms-lock-up-lopez/#comment-174118</guid>
		<description>For one, I think Hargrove and the coaches messed him up too much by urging him to be a &quot;move him over&quot; hitter.  Two, I really don&#039;t see much to indicate they are working to get Jose back to driving the ball to the alleys.  As long as Grover is here, he isn&#039;t going to hurry to change Jose back.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For one, I think Hargrove and the coaches messed him up too much by urging him to be a &#8220;move him over&#8221; hitter.  Two, I really don&#8217;t see much to indicate they are working to get Jose back to driving the ball to the alleys.  As long as Grover is here, he isn&#8217;t going to hurry to change Jose back.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: David*</title>
		<link>http://www.ussmariner.com/2007/04/18/ms-lock-up-lopez/comment-page-2/#comment-174107</link>
		<dc:creator>David*</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Apr 2007 02:43:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ussmariner.com/2007/04/18/ms-lock-up-lopez/#comment-174107</guid>
		<description>62:

Are you saying Lopez lacks grit?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>62:</p>
<p>Are you saying Lopez lacks grit?</p>
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		<title>By: loki</title>
		<link>http://www.ussmariner.com/2007/04/18/ms-lock-up-lopez/comment-page-2/#comment-174104</link>
		<dc:creator>loki</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Apr 2007 02:33:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ussmariner.com/2007/04/18/ms-lock-up-lopez/#comment-174104</guid>
		<description>Why does Grover need to be out of here for Jose to be a plus bat?  I don&#039;t have a problem with Hargrove leaving, I&#039;m just saying the two don&#039;t necessarily have to be connected.  Why can&#039;t Jose change back to his pull-hitting ways a bit while Hargrove is still here?  He&#039;s not hitting 2nd anymore where Grover seemed to ask him to put down the sac bunt all the time...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Why does Grover need to be out of here for Jose to be a plus bat?  I don&#8217;t have a problem with Hargrove leaving, I&#8217;m just saying the two don&#8217;t necessarily have to be connected.  Why can&#8217;t Jose change back to his pull-hitting ways a bit while Hargrove is still here?  He&#8217;s not hitting 2nd anymore where Grover seemed to ask him to put down the sac bunt all the time&#8230;</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: atait</title>
		<link>http://www.ussmariner.com/2007/04/18/ms-lock-up-lopez/comment-page-2/#comment-174096</link>
		<dc:creator>atait</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Apr 2007 01:57:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ussmariner.com/2007/04/18/ms-lock-up-lopez/#comment-174096</guid>
		<description>Personally, I think it will be a boon for Jose&#039;s future once Hargrove leaves town.  Hargrove turned Jose into a worm-killing, move the runner over-hitter who has lost some aggressiveness at the plate.

Jose has the potential to be a plus bat at 2B, but that&#039;s contingent on getter Grover out of here.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Personally, I think it will be a boon for Jose&#8217;s future once Hargrove leaves town.  Hargrove turned Jose into a worm-killing, move the runner over-hitter who has lost some aggressiveness at the plate.</p>
<p>Jose has the potential to be a plus bat at 2B, but that&#8217;s contingent on getter Grover out of here.</p>
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		<title>By: wilymo</title>
		<link>http://www.ussmariner.com/2007/04/18/ms-lock-up-lopez/comment-page-2/#comment-174095</link>
		<dc:creator>wilymo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Apr 2007 01:52:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ussmariner.com/2007/04/18/ms-lock-up-lopez/#comment-174095</guid>
		<description>Also look at the deals that Matt Cain and Harden signed after their first full seasons.  4 year deals that bought out 2 arbitration years.  4 years - 9-10 mil.  Like I said, Felix has a much higher ceiling, but both of them had better first full years statistically than Felix.  In arbitration, you get paid for what you&#039;ve done moreso than what you might do.  If Felix waits until after the season or atleast until after a half of season of doing what he&#039;s doing to sign a long-term deal then who knows what he might sign for.  He&#039;s gonna get more than Cain and Harden but he&#039;s not going to get paid as if he were a free agent either.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Also look at the deals that Matt Cain and Harden signed after their first full seasons.  4 year deals that bought out 2 arbitration years.  4 years &#8211; 9-10 mil.  Like I said, Felix has a much higher ceiling, but both of them had better first full years statistically than Felix.  In arbitration, you get paid for what you&#8217;ve done moreso than what you might do.  If Felix waits until after the season or atleast until after a half of season of doing what he&#8217;s doing to sign a long-term deal then who knows what he might sign for.  He&#8217;s gonna get more than Cain and Harden but he&#8217;s not going to get paid as if he were a free agent either.</p>
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		<title>By: david h</title>
		<link>http://www.ussmariner.com/2007/04/18/ms-lock-up-lopez/comment-page-2/#comment-174094</link>
		<dc:creator>david h</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Apr 2007 01:47:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ussmariner.com/2007/04/18/ms-lock-up-lopez/#comment-174094</guid>
		<description>58 - he&#039;s pretty much the last of the &quot;hitters&quot; to be so successful</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>58 &#8211; he&#8217;s pretty much the last of the &#8220;hitters&#8221; to be so successful</p>
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		<title>By: em</title>
		<link>http://www.ussmariner.com/2007/04/18/ms-lock-up-lopez/comment-page-2/#comment-174093</link>
		<dc:creator>em</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Apr 2007 01:47:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ussmariner.com/2007/04/18/ms-lock-up-lopez/#comment-174093</guid>
		<description>Williams was not a &quot;dead pull&quot; hitter.  He wanted to pull, just as we want Lopez to pull.  That was the point of my post - he preferred to hit a ball with maximum bat speed.

Consider also that Williams belonged to a different era, when the slider was emerging as a force in the pitcher&#039;s arsenal.  Williams acknowledged that the slider was the most difficult pitch to hit because it messed with his timing and pitch recognition.  Imagine Williams having to hit a Clemens split-finger or a Felix two-seamer??  Get out in front of a pitch just a little and you are tearing up the infield grass (splitters).  Miss-time the cutter because you are swinging for the middle of the plate but it bears to the inside corner, and you are hitting off the handle (getting &quot;jammed&quot;).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Williams was not a &#8220;dead pull&#8221; hitter.  He wanted to pull, just as we want Lopez to pull.  That was the point of my post &#8211; he preferred to hit a ball with maximum bat speed.</p>
<p>Consider also that Williams belonged to a different era, when the slider was emerging as a force in the pitcher&#8217;s arsenal.  Williams acknowledged that the slider was the most difficult pitch to hit because it messed with his timing and pitch recognition.  Imagine Williams having to hit a Clemens split-finger or a Felix two-seamer??  Get out in front of a pitch just a little and you are tearing up the infield grass (splitters).  Miss-time the cutter because you are swinging for the middle of the plate but it bears to the inside corner, and you are hitting off the handle (getting &#8220;jammed&#8221;).</p>
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		<title>By: colm</title>
		<link>http://www.ussmariner.com/2007/04/18/ms-lock-up-lopez/comment-page-2/#comment-174092</link>
		<dc:creator>colm</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Apr 2007 01:42:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ussmariner.com/2007/04/18/ms-lock-up-lopez/#comment-174092</guid>
		<description>As phenomenal as Williams was, isn&#039;t he also considered the last of the &quot;dead-red pull hitters&quot; to be so successful?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As phenomenal as Williams was, isn&#8217;t he also considered the last of the &#8220;dead-red pull hitters&#8221; to be so successful?</p>
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