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	<title>Comments on: Honor Where Honor Is Due</title>
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	<link>http://www.ussmariner.com/2007/06/28/honor-where-honor-is-due/</link>
	<description>Seattle Mariners blog and general baseball discussion</description>
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		<title>By: Karen</title>
		<link>http://www.ussmariner.com/2007/06/28/honor-where-honor-is-due/comment-page-4/#comment-201886</link>
		<dc:creator>Karen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 30 Jun 2007 02:29:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ussmariner.com/2007/06/28/honor-where-honor-is-due/#comment-201886</guid>
		<description>In other &lt;i&gt;&quot;are you kidding me?&quot;&lt;/i&gt; news, ESPN.com has the Mariners ranked #9 in their &lt;a href=&quot;http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/powerranking?week=13&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Power Rankings&lt;/a&gt;, just ahead of the Brewers.

Yeah, I know, it&#039;s a little like looking at Rumor Central there, but the last time I looked at their power rankings, the M&#039;s were down around #25.  Sheesh.

Don&#039;t start bragging yet, anyone.  I&#039;d just as soon have the Mariners lie in the weeds and sneak up on some of these other teams, as long as they&#039;re capable.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In other <i>&#8220;are you kidding me?&#8221;</i> news, ESPN.com has the Mariners ranked #9 in their <a href="http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/powerranking?week=13" rel="nofollow">Power Rankings</a>, just ahead of the Brewers.</p>
<p>Yeah, I know, it&#8217;s a little like looking at Rumor Central there, but the last time I looked at their power rankings, the M&#8217;s were down around #25.  Sheesh.</p>
<p>Don&#8217;t start bragging yet, anyone.  I&#8217;d just as soon have the Mariners lie in the weeds and sneak up on some of these other teams, as long as they&#8217;re capable.</p>
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		<title>By: Chris Miller</title>
		<link>http://www.ussmariner.com/2007/06/28/honor-where-honor-is-due/comment-page-4/#comment-201866</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris Miller</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 30 Jun 2007 00:34:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ussmariner.com/2007/06/28/honor-where-honor-is-due/#comment-201866</guid>
		<description>Could the situation w/ Reed be similar to Cameron or &#039;05 Beltre at Safeco, where it becomes mental and not just park factors?  I haven&#039;t looked at Reeds splits, or have I seen him play this year.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Could the situation w/ Reed be similar to Cameron or &#8217;05 Beltre at Safeco, where it becomes mental and not just park factors?  I haven&#8217;t looked at Reeds splits, or have I seen him play this year.</p>
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		<title>By: Colorado Mariner Fan</title>
		<link>http://www.ussmariner.com/2007/06/28/honor-where-honor-is-due/comment-page-4/#comment-201856</link>
		<dc:creator>Colorado Mariner Fan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Jun 2007 23:09:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ussmariner.com/2007/06/28/honor-where-honor-is-due/#comment-201856</guid>
		<description>Grizz (#170) - Yeah, I considered that. But it seems so extreme for Reed. He&#039;s about 100 points lower in AVG and OBP, and about 150 lower in SLG. In a similar number of AB, Jones is roughly -40/-60/-130, and Wlad actually seems to like Tacoma *better* at roughly +10/+30/-40.

Seems weird it affects Reed so dramatically. He&#039;s essentially a different player at home. At least on offense.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Grizz (#170) &#8211; Yeah, I considered that. But it seems so extreme for Reed. He&#8217;s about 100 points lower in AVG and OBP, and about 150 lower in SLG. In a similar number of AB, Jones is roughly -40/-60/-130, and Wlad actually seems to like Tacoma *better* at roughly +10/+30/-40.</p>
<p>Seems weird it affects Reed so dramatically. He&#8217;s essentially a different player at home. At least on offense.</p>
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		<title>By: eponymous coward</title>
		<link>http://www.ussmariner.com/2007/06/28/honor-where-honor-is-due/comment-page-4/#comment-201842</link>
		<dc:creator>eponymous coward</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Jun 2007 22:14:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ussmariner.com/2007/06/28/honor-where-honor-is-due/#comment-201842</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt; I was the guy who ragged on all the â€œexpertsâ€ and the people who were ready to throw Weaver under the bus and run over him several times a month ago (i admit I was almost there, though).&lt;/i&gt;

I don&#039;t think Weaver&#039;s recent performance is all that, either. If you think it is, than I&#039;ll point out that Joel Pineiro was sporting a 3.72 ERA on May 11th, 2006. He&#039;s keeping more teams off balance by mixing his stuff better, but it hasn&#039;t really improved, and while Weaver wasn&#039;t really as bad as he looked in April and May, he&#039;s not as good as a 2-0, 1.82 ERA June is telling us, either. His success is predicated on not having given up a HR in June. That&#039;s just not going to be sustainable.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i> I was the guy who ragged on all the â€œexpertsâ€ and the people who were ready to throw Weaver under the bus and run over him several times a month ago (i admit I was almost there, though).</i></p>
<p>I don&#8217;t think Weaver&#8217;s recent performance is all that, either. If you think it is, than I&#8217;ll point out that Joel Pineiro was sporting a 3.72 ERA on May 11th, 2006. He&#8217;s keeping more teams off balance by mixing his stuff better, but it hasn&#8217;t really improved, and while Weaver wasn&#8217;t really as bad as he looked in April and May, he&#8217;s not as good as a 2-0, 1.82 ERA June is telling us, either. His success is predicated on not having given up a HR in June. That&#8217;s just not going to be sustainable.</p>
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		<title>By: eponymous coward</title>
		<link>http://www.ussmariner.com/2007/06/28/honor-where-honor-is-due/comment-page-4/#comment-201840</link>
		<dc:creator>eponymous coward</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Jun 2007 22:05:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ussmariner.com/2007/06/28/honor-where-honor-is-due/#comment-201840</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;I think OPS works if youâ€™re measuring DHs who are power hitters, and Vidro never really has been such. You donâ€™t sign a Vidro to hit 20 home runs and knock in 80 runs now. The fact is he has the second-best OBP on the club among regulars, behind only Ichiro, the has the third-most walks on the team (and only 22 strikeouts) and he has 80 hits, again, second-most behind Ichiro.&lt;/i&gt;

I can cherry pick things that make anyone look good if you give me enough of them. Willie Bloomquist has a GREAT stolen base percentage and plays a lot of positions, so he&#039;s a good player, right?

AL designated hitters have a composite stat line of .263/.355/.442. Vidro&#039;s is .295/.355/.362. This makes him average among DHs at getting on base, very bad for hitting for power... and Seattle&#039;s DH&#039;s lead the league in GIDP (13)- ALL of them Vidro&#039;s.

There is no reasonable standard where you can say he&#039;s a GOOD DH. The best you can say is that Vidro hasn&#039;t been a complete trainwreck like KC&#039;s DH&#039;s (.237/.295/.368) or Minnesota&#039;s ( .241/.323/.333), but &quot;Only 10 or 11 teams have better DH performance in the league, and Vidro&#039;s not SUPPOSED to be a good hitter&quot; is not a good argument.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>I think OPS works if youâ€™re measuring DHs who are power hitters, and Vidro never really has been such. You donâ€™t sign a Vidro to hit 20 home runs and knock in 80 runs now. The fact is he has the second-best OBP on the club among regulars, behind only Ichiro, the has the third-most walks on the team (and only 22 strikeouts) and he has 80 hits, again, second-most behind Ichiro.</i></p>
<p>I can cherry pick things that make anyone look good if you give me enough of them. Willie Bloomquist has a GREAT stolen base percentage and plays a lot of positions, so he&#8217;s a good player, right?</p>
<p>AL designated hitters have a composite stat line of .263/.355/.442. Vidro&#8217;s is .295/.355/.362. This makes him average among DHs at getting on base, very bad for hitting for power&#8230; and Seattle&#8217;s DH&#8217;s lead the league in GIDP (13)- ALL of them Vidro&#8217;s.</p>
<p>There is no reasonable standard where you can say he&#8217;s a GOOD DH. The best you can say is that Vidro hasn&#8217;t been a complete trainwreck like KC&#8217;s DH&#8217;s (.237/.295/.368) or Minnesota&#8217;s ( .241/.323/.333), but &#8220;Only 10 or 11 teams have better DH performance in the league, and Vidro&#8217;s not SUPPOSED to be a good hitter&#8221; is not a good argument.</p>
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		<title>By: Dave</title>
		<link>http://www.ussmariner.com/2007/06/28/honor-where-honor-is-due/comment-page-4/#comment-201839</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Jun 2007 22:03:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ussmariner.com/2007/06/28/honor-where-honor-is-due/#comment-201839</guid>
		<description>http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/statpages/glossary/</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/statpages/glossary/" rel="nofollow">http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/statpages/glossary/</a></p>
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		<title>By: DiamondDave</title>
		<link>http://www.ussmariner.com/2007/06/28/honor-where-honor-is-due/comment-page-4/#comment-201832</link>
		<dc:creator>DiamondDave</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Jun 2007 21:45:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ussmariner.com/2007/06/28/honor-where-honor-is-due/#comment-201832</guid>
		<description>I posted this in an earlier thread but I doubt anyone is going to read it (four days ago) so I&#039;ll repost. I was the guy who ragged on all the &quot;experts&quot; and the people who were ready to throw Weaver under the bus and run over him several times a month ago (i admit I was almost there, though). Here&#039;s my post, with a legitimate question at the end. Thanks for your patience:

&lt;i&gt;Iâ€™m no expert either. Iâ€™m Just a baseball fan. I donâ€™t spend time looking at sites that give actual percentage for a team to win DURING the game. And I donâ€™t look at sites that peg the Ms playoff chances day by day. Iâ€™m too busy watching/listening to the games and reading this blog.

DOnâ€™t get me wrong, I love this blog. I bought Derekâ€™s book. I learn something all the time. Iâ€™m just a smart-ass  Donâ€™t pay me any mind.

While I admitting my ignorance, where can I find a handy llist for the all the acronyms used freely here. I know what WHIP is, I know what OPS is, but beyond that Iâ€™m generall sitting here goingâ€¦ â€œ???â€

thanking you in advance.

if anyone wants to mail me offline my address is dhirning@comcast.net.

Go Ms,

D.
&lt;/i&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I posted this in an earlier thread but I doubt anyone is going to read it (four days ago) so I&#8217;ll repost. I was the guy who ragged on all the &#8220;experts&#8221; and the people who were ready to throw Weaver under the bus and run over him several times a month ago (i admit I was almost there, though). Here&#8217;s my post, with a legitimate question at the end. Thanks for your patience:</p>
<p><i>Iâ€™m no expert either. Iâ€™m Just a baseball fan. I donâ€™t spend time looking at sites that give actual percentage for a team to win DURING the game. And I donâ€™t look at sites that peg the Ms playoff chances day by day. Iâ€™m too busy watching/listening to the games and reading this blog.</p>
<p>DOnâ€™t get me wrong, I love this blog. I bought Derekâ€™s book. I learn something all the time. Iâ€™m just a smart-ass  Donâ€™t pay me any mind.</p>
<p>While I admitting my ignorance, where can I find a handy llist for the all the acronyms used freely here. I know what WHIP is, I know what OPS is, but beyond that Iâ€™m generall sitting here goingâ€¦ â€œ???â€</p>
<p>thanking you in advance.</p>
<p>if anyone wants to mail me offline my address is <a href="mailto:dhirning@comcast.net">dhirning@comcast.net</a>.</p>
<p>Go Ms,</p>
<p>D.<br />
</i></p>
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		<title>By: Ralph Malph</title>
		<link>http://www.ussmariner.com/2007/06/28/honor-where-honor-is-due/comment-page-4/#comment-201821</link>
		<dc:creator>Ralph Malph</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Jun 2007 21:04:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ussmariner.com/2007/06/28/honor-where-honor-is-due/#comment-201821</guid>
		<description>facile?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>facile?</p>
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		<title>By: Dave</title>
		<link>http://www.ussmariner.com/2007/06/28/honor-where-honor-is-due/comment-page-4/#comment-201820</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Jun 2007 21:03:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ussmariner.com/2007/06/28/honor-where-honor-is-due/#comment-201820</guid>
		<description>Honestly, the whole defending Vidro thing is impossible.  He sucks, and you need to admit he sucks.  This team has the fewest strikeouts in the majors - they certainly don&#039;t need a DH who has &quot;bat control&quot;.

Vidro&#039;s terrible.  Just admit it and move on.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Honestly, the whole defending Vidro thing is impossible.  He sucks, and you need to admit he sucks.  This team has the fewest strikeouts in the majors &#8211; they certainly don&#8217;t need a DH who has &#8220;bat control&#8221;.</p>
<p>Vidro&#8217;s terrible.  Just admit it and move on.</p>
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		<title>By: BKM</title>
		<link>http://www.ussmariner.com/2007/06/28/honor-where-honor-is-due/comment-page-4/#comment-201818</link>
		<dc:creator>BKM</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Jun 2007 20:50:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ussmariner.com/2007/06/28/honor-where-honor-is-due/#comment-201818</guid>
		<description>174. I know your point was to emphasize Ichiro&#039;s awesomnity, but it&#039;s a good thing Ichiro&#039;s mobile and facile enough to use in the field so he doesn&#039;t have to be a DH.

I think OPS works if you&#039;re measuring DHs who are power hitters, and Vidro never really has been such. You don&#039;t sign a Vidro to hit 20 home runs and knock in 80 runs now. The fact is he has the second-best OBP on the club among regulars, behind only Ichiro, the has the third-most walks on the team (and only 22 strikeouts) and he has 80 hits, again, second-most behind Ichiro.

I know - only 9 of Vidro&#039;s hits have been for even one extra base, he doesn&#039;t run well and he has grounded out into too many GIDP. 

His hits might be passed off as &quot;empty at-bats,&quot; but does it really matter HOW you get on base but THAT you get on base?

Richie Sexson and his 15 home runs and 46 (and 57K) has his place, along with Beltre (10, 31, 38)... but you need someone who can handle the bat (get base hits and draw walks, and occasionally lay down a bunt, which he&#039;s done a team-leading  times), and that&#039;s what Vidro&#039;s brought.

For the cynics who look for opportunities to chide and those who rely only on numbers, I&#039;m sure this is a laughable position, but these raw stats tell me enough that Vidro doesn&#039;t deserve the derision he&#039;s afforded here and deserves some of the credit.

And, 177, have you arbitrarily replaced Sexson with Johjima as your cleanup hitter? And are you willing to put Jones, who&#039;s still learning to play the outfield (as this is his second year out there), in CF for your playoff team?

If you can Bavasi, even if this team goes to the playoffs, who do you hire as GM?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>174. I know your point was to emphasize Ichiro&#8217;s awesomnity, but it&#8217;s a good thing Ichiro&#8217;s mobile and facile enough to use in the field so he doesn&#8217;t have to be a DH.</p>
<p>I think OPS works if you&#8217;re measuring DHs who are power hitters, and Vidro never really has been such. You don&#8217;t sign a Vidro to hit 20 home runs and knock in 80 runs now. The fact is he has the second-best OBP on the club among regulars, behind only Ichiro, the has the third-most walks on the team (and only 22 strikeouts) and he has 80 hits, again, second-most behind Ichiro.</p>
<p>I know &#8211; only 9 of Vidro&#8217;s hits have been for even one extra base, he doesn&#8217;t run well and he has grounded out into too many GIDP. </p>
<p>His hits might be passed off as &#8220;empty at-bats,&#8221; but does it really matter HOW you get on base but THAT you get on base?</p>
<p>Richie Sexson and his 15 home runs and 46 (and 57K) has his place, along with Beltre (10, 31, 38)&#8230; but you need someone who can handle the bat (get base hits and draw walks, and occasionally lay down a bunt, which he&#8217;s done a team-leading  times), and that&#8217;s what Vidro&#8217;s brought.</p>
<p>For the cynics who look for opportunities to chide and those who rely only on numbers, I&#8217;m sure this is a laughable position, but these raw stats tell me enough that Vidro doesn&#8217;t deserve the derision he&#8217;s afforded here and deserves some of the credit.</p>
<p>And, 177, have you arbitrarily replaced Sexson with Johjima as your cleanup hitter? And are you willing to put Jones, who&#8217;s still learning to play the outfield (as this is his second year out there), in CF for your playoff team?</p>
<p>If you can Bavasi, even if this team goes to the playoffs, who do you hire as GM?</p>
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