Dave · December 16, 2004 at 8:50 am · Filed Under Mariners 

The Beltre or Bust wagon is gaining steam.

they are thought to be close — or possibly already have reached agreement — on a deal worth $60 million or more to third baseman Adrian Beltre.

I’ll tell you right now that they haven’t reached an agreement, unfortunately. But Finnigan is right; they are close. It’s really Adrian Beltre’s call, at this point. If he decides that he just doesn’t want to leave LA, Boras will get something done with the Dodgers. If the ties to the Dodgers aren’t as strong as some think, though, we could have a deal very soon.


132 Responses to “Optimism”

  1. Rob on December 16th, 2004 1:38 pm

    To me this yes he signed is different then sexson, all the papers were reporting it. However it wasnt the top news on espn. I hope gammons isn’t wrong. It is intereting listening to finnegan on espnnews and espn radio.

  2. Paul Molitor Cocktail on December 16th, 2004 1:43 pm

    Hot damn!

  3. Troy on December 16th, 2004 1:44 pm

    Holy crap, this is awesome. 5 years at 13 million in this market? Is everyone else in baseball asleep at the wheel? Wow!

    I know this may not be a popular sentiment here, but I think this more than makes up for the Sexson deal. That deal was bad to be sure, even for the poor market. But given the market, this deal is incredible.

    If it’s true, that is.

    BTW, I agree with Scraps in 93. I hate to advocate making people pay to post, but if you did, it would clean alot of things up in a hurry. I know if the price was reasonable, plenty of us would sign up.

  4. DaddyO on December 16th, 2004 1:46 pm

    I learned something from this thread, so to me it was worthwhile to listen to both sides. Is Derek an emotional guy? Yes. Did he needlessly use a loaded term (“ridiculous”) to flame the poster he disagreed with? Yes. Did FrozenRope use a loaded term (“rudimentary”) that escalated the emotion? Yes. Would it be a mistake to turn off comments? IMHO, Yes, because it would deprive us of opportunities to hear multiple sides of an issue. Do the web owners have a right to do it? Of course. Do I plan on continuing to learn from this board? Yes. It’s an American pastime to flame your opponent; just don’t let it stop you from listening.

  5. Bill J on December 16th, 2004 1:48 pm

    #101 – Right on, and that’s what scares me about this report. I can’t believe there weren’t other teams stepping up to the plate at that price and in this market. Consider everything crossed (damn it’s hard to type this way!). 🙂

  6. Long GOne on December 16th, 2004 1:49 pm

    1:50 p.m., 12-17-04, Fox Sports and Sporting News Ken Rosenthal are reporting that the Mariners have signed the big bopper 3B of the Dodgers for 5 years, 64 Million! They quote Gammons at ESPN also.

  7. Frozenropers on December 16th, 2004 1:52 pm

    #107: That last part is what worries me…..they are all quoting Peter Gammons as the “source”. :o(

  8. roger tang on December 16th, 2004 1:53 pm


    If this is true, I think I’ll just rearrange the figures in my head and say Sexson signed for $30 million for four years and Beltre for $90 million for six years…..That kinda math works for me…

  9. Troy on December 16th, 2004 1:53 pm

    *turning blue as I hold my breath*

    Derek, Dave, Jason, I know you guys might be a little torqued at being told what to say on your own site, but if you could break the silence of the past few hours and confirm if this is legit or not you would be heroes.

    Of course, maybe you’ve just been too busy working the phones (or doing your day jobs) to post lately too. I’m not trying to jump to conclusions here. I’d just love to hear it from someone I trust a heckuva lot more than Gammons. Thanks guys.

  10. Buhnerboy on December 16th, 2004 1:55 pm

    Is it just me, or has ESPN.com been very slow/poor/non-existent in breaking news lately. Still nothing up on the site. When Fox Sports beats you to the punch consistently, it’s a bit embarrassing.

  11. roger tang on December 16th, 2004 1:57 pm

    Ghahh. It’s Gammons! Suddenly, I’m not so optimistic on this…

  12. J.R. on December 16th, 2004 1:59 pm

    “Or, have I just bought into the propoganda of that is why our past teams have no power.”

    The past teams had no power because the middle of the line-up had an above average power hitter in Boone and a Line-drive, high avarager hitter in Edgar, there was no power on the past teams to be had, it had nothing to do with what side of the plate they were standing on.

  13. Long Gone on December 16th, 2004 2:00 pm

    Go to Foxsports.com. Picture of Randy Johnson with red over his head in headline. Click. That is where I found it.

  14. dmc on December 16th, 2004 2:00 pm

    add MSNBC to the list of those reporting the deal is done.

  15. michael lewis (not that one) on December 16th, 2004 2:01 pm

    Russ (re: 85): What I was trying to get across was that being a GM is about weighing risks, and free agent signings must weigh risk vs. reward. Spiezio, had anyone in the front office bothered to actually check his track record, did not provide enough reward for the signing, given the full-time role he was expected to play (at either first or third). It was generally a bad signing then, and it got worse, simply because of his utter collapse. Spiezio’s had, really, one good season, and even that was nothing to write home about for a first basemen. When I mentioned signing a less impactful offensive player than Sexson that had a higher probability of actually staying in the lineup, I meant someone like Kevin Millar. Obviously, he’s under contract with Boston, but that’s a good example. A decent OBP guy with moderate power that can smack the ball around a bit. Olerud wasn’t considered, at least around here, as a bad guy to have around. He was generally exposed against lefties, and should have been platooned, but the M’s didn’t need to eat his contract and release him. For the term of his contract, Olerud was a fine signing.

    Now, I haven’t seen Sexson’s physical records (no doubt I wouldn’t understand them if I did), but I don’t think it’s true that anyone necessarily believes Sexson’s shoulder is “golden.” Whether or not Sexson’s shoulder holds up is really an open question. Will Carroll suggests that there’s a high risk of recurrence due to the nature of the injury, how it occurred, and the mechanics of swinging a bat. That said, I don’t know how Sexson’s shoulder will hold up, maybe the doctor’s used magic glue to make sure it’ll never be hurt again. My only point is that the risk of his shoulder blowing up is much greater than that of someone who’s shoulder has not blown up. As such, perhaps the M’s should have been a little more conscious about the number of years and dollars they threw at him. Delgado would be a better risk, despite that he’s older than Sexson. Delgado’s knee problems, such as they are, don’t carry the same risk of career ending recurrence that Sexson’s shoulder does. The risk Delgado carries is the possibility of declining performance. However, neither player really makes much sense once the dollar amount goes beyond a certain point, because then you start being able to find equivalent performers for less money. At some financial level, everyone becomes replaceable talent.

    On a final note: Beltre is a great signing.

  16. Eric on December 16th, 2004 2:01 pm

    111, one difference is ESPN.com doesn’t have to regularly pull back stories that they ran with too soon the way Fox does:-)

  17. Westfried on December 16th, 2004 2:02 pm

    Derek, Frozen,

    Here’s what I see. The discussion of whether the Mariners can/did/would/should/will/won’t assign Sexson’s Bonus to the ’04 budget is a good topic. The tone, however, degenerated quickly. From what I saw, FR came in with an “interesting idea” as “food for thought”, and Derek blasted it. You have to admit, DMZ’s response in #8 was pretty harsh, which FR then took personally. However, the topic *eventually* got to a good yes/no/whatif/etc. discussion.

    The rips against Derek and crew are totally unjustified, as this is their forum to speak their minds. Yes, I think Derek was too harsh in #8, but he is generally fair, and always informative. Maybe pointing out that he could have been nicer in his response would have been sufficient. But FR took the bait, and a bunch of people piled on.

    If I want invective, name-calling, or infantile crap, I’ll go read the PI blog. I liked Dave’s post about keeping comments fair, pointed, and informative. I think we all agree that USSM is the best site for Mariners news, discussion, insights, and ideas.

    In the meantime, I really hope Beltre is true, so we can start talking about something positive for the M’s!


  18. Jeff in Fremont on December 16th, 2004 2:03 pm
  19. Long Gone on December 16th, 2004 2:07 pm

    ESPN is now reporting it on ESPN.com.

  20. Chris Miller on December 16th, 2004 2:07 pm

    I’m assuming the Delgado talk was a smoke screen. Nobody, not even Bavasi would pay a 1st baseman w/ a bad knee 16 or 17 mil in their 36 year old season, or get two star 1st basemen. I suspected they were trying to minimize their involvment in discussions with Beltre. I hope we can pick up a decent starting pitcher either via Free Agency or a trade. Who might be available for trade? I know Beane wouldn’t trade with us, and you know Johnson wouldn’t come here, and we probably wouldn’t want him, so who else could be pick up?

  21. Evan on December 16th, 2004 2:07 pm

    Where’s Chris Kahrl when you need her, eh?

    Beltre for 5 years is a spectacular deal. We effectively avoid his entire decline phase. Sexson’s still a big injury risk, but a season of Beltre + half a season of Sexson means this team suddenly has a credible offense.

    Now we focus on pitching.

  22. DAVID J CORCORAN on December 16th, 2004 2:07 pm

    FREE BEER AT MY HOUSE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


  23. Peter on December 16th, 2004 2:08 pm

    CBS Sportsline, the pathetic stepchild of the sports hotlines, is now confirming the story as well. Scott Miller is the source. They say $65 million.

  24. Jeff in Fremont on December 16th, 2004 2:09 pm
  25. Adam T on December 16th, 2004 2:12 pm


  26. J.R. on December 16th, 2004 2:15 pm

    best. news. yet.

  27. Matt Bjorke on December 16th, 2004 2:16 pm

    As I was driving in my car I let out a huge YEAH! KJR has been rappin and flappin about it since ESPN posted it. 65 Million over five years =13mil per year. YEAH!!!!!! No way this isn’t true. Even Sportsline had this “Beltre Jumps to Free Spending Mariners” When have we EVER heard that phrase before?

  28. DAVID J CORCORAN on December 16th, 2004 2:18 pm

    I am sitting here at work, and when I saw on Trent and Jeff’s blog, I jumped up, screamed “YEASSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!”, AND everyone around me got freaked out. According to reports I was 2 feet off the ground.

  29. Intolerance on December 16th, 2004 2:19 pm


  30. Deanna on December 16th, 2004 2:21 pm

    Well, that’s good. Otherwise the Pizza Feed was going to be an extremely somber event.

  31. Bram on December 16th, 2004 2:21 pm

    Swung on and Beltre’d!

  32. DAVID J CORCORAN on December 16th, 2004 2:22 pm

    I am going to give my presents to charity after this. And I am buying everyone at work a beer!

    Today is the Best Day Of My Life!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!