Hargrove hiccup

DMZ · January 25, 2005 at 6:47 pm · Filed Under Mariners 

Hargrove once, by not turning in a proper lineup card, lost the DH in a game. He had Manny Ramirez as DH, though he’d decided to play him in RF. When Ramirez trotted out to right, that was it for the DH. Charles Nagy went 0-2. Check out the boxscore.

I love the stuff I stumble across doing unrelated research.


26 Responses to “Hargrove hiccup”

  1. Tom B on January 25th, 2005 7:02 pm

    That’s a pretty nice lineup for cleveland back then..

    lofton/vizquele/alomar/thome/sexson/manny/aramis ramirez..

    didnt realize they were so stacked back then..

  2. David J Corcoran on January 25th, 2005 7:05 pm

    What an awful defensive outfield! Sexson/Lofton/Ramirez?! The corners are scaryily bad. Lofton is good, but still…

  3. DG on January 25th, 2005 7:49 pm

    almost as funny as formerAstros oitcher and M’s scout Charley Kerfeld having a contract that paid him $86,500 and 37 boxes of orange Jell-o.

  4. Corey on January 25th, 2005 7:50 pm

    No, that’s not Aramis Ramirez. It’s Alex Ramirez, who, I believe, is now a star for a Japanese team.

  5. David at PLU on January 25th, 2005 9:29 pm

    I remember that game. Niehaus was talking about it during the Mariners game that same night.

  6. Jack Howland on January 25th, 2005 9:43 pm

    How did Alex Ramirez get a put out? He must have at least played defense in the top of the first inning.

  7. Jack Howland on January 25th, 2005 9:58 pm


    The boxscore is incorrect. Manny probably should be credited with three assists instead of two. Alex with zero instead of one.

  8. NJL on January 25th, 2005 10:43 pm

    I remember that Hargrove got quite a bit of criticism for the mistake, especially since they only lost by one run, but I don’t think Alex Ramirez was likely to do much better than 0-2 anyway.

  9. Saint Jimmy on January 26th, 2005 12:06 am

    Not in the lineup that day is a still-very-productive David Justice, who normally manned left field that year.

    Six guys in the regular lineup (Lofton, Vizquel, Alomar, Thome, Ramirez, Justice) who had .395+ OBP’s? Yikes. Too bad they couldn’t pitch.

  10. John on January 26th, 2005 1:13 am

    Are you sure that that’s the way it really was?
    Given the dramatis personae, it’s more likely that RAMIREZ nonchalantly trotted out to RF, instead of taking a seat on the bench; and HARGROVE covered up for him with this second-thought story.

  11. Conor Glassey on January 26th, 2005 2:04 am

    DG – Did Kerfeld throw a knuckleball? My Neyer/James says he only threw a fastball, but I know that knuckleballers have to eat a lot of gelatin because it helps to strengthen your fingernails. Either way, it’s certainly odd for a contract – thanks for the random fact!

  12. DG on January 26th, 2005 4:40 am

    I dunno Glassey, But i’ll ask him. That’s a good point, too.

  13. Bjoern on January 26th, 2005 5:36 am

    I don’t realy understand the boxscore. Why do the pitchers only have two PA’s combined? It also doesn’t seem like he did some doubleswitches, as there are no defensive replacements. And there where no SH’s for Cleveland, but there was one for Toronto, so they are not missing on the sheet. Somehow, some AB’s are missing.

  14. Brent Overman on January 26th, 2005 7:49 am

    Very Bill Plummer-esque, as Plummer himself made a similar mistake in his lone season at the helm of the Mariners. If I recall correctly, he put both Pete O’Brien and Tino Martinez in at first base, causing that day’s pitcher to take a spot in the batting order, somewhere in the middle of the lineup.

  15. Morisseau on January 26th, 2005 9:33 am

    not to mention a young Brian Giles languishing on their bench, whom they traded for …. Ricardo Rincon. Think they’d like to have that deal back?

  16. Adam S on January 26th, 2005 9:42 am

    #12. For some reason the pinch hitters for the pitchers aren’t listed. See http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/baseball/mlb/al/scoreboards/1999/07/22/finalbox.cleveland.toronto.0307.html for a different box score that shows them.

  17. Almost Daily on January 26th, 2005 9:52 am
    This would never have happened with Edgar
    The guys at USS Mariner have a
    funny little tidbit about the new M’s Manager, Mick Hargrove and how he learned the importance of checking the lineup card very carefully before each game.
    Yep, when you lose your DH because of a foul up like this, …

  18. Rusty on January 26th, 2005 10:19 am

    Just prior to the one World Series he was in, Hargrove claimed that adapting to NL rules wasn’t “rocket science”, and then he subsequently botched a double switch move that he attempted to make.

  19. vj on January 26th, 2005 10:42 am

    Rusty, Hargrove managed in two world series, 95 and 97.

  20. Ralph Malph on January 26th, 2005 11:10 am

    I bet he won’t do this again.

  21. Shoeless Jose on January 26th, 2005 12:14 pm

    Kind of funny — one team using NL rules, the other AL. Would like to see a World Series like this for laughs (yes, I’m kidding — and why doesn’t the allstar game always use AL rules? With all the bats available wants to see those pitchers hit?)

    I didn’t realize Hargrove had coached Sexson before. I wonder how much that factored into the decision to go after him this offseason?

  22. DG on January 26th, 2005 4:42 pm

    Kerfeld say he did not throw the knuckler. Low to mid 90’s heat, power slider and a change.

  23. Conor Glassey on January 26th, 2005 4:48 pm

    Thanks DG – Guess he’s just a Jell-O fan!

  24. paul mocker on January 26th, 2005 5:15 pm

    1. Where was the bench coach when Hargrove mess this up? BTW, I honestly don’t know what a bench coach does.

    2. If Manny stood in RF for one batter, do the rules allow a manager to remove him and put in the real RF? In other words, do the rules allow the manager to make a claim such as this: “I knew he was my DH, but he wasn’t playing RF. He wasn’t going to make a play anyway and my real RF is in the game now. So I didn’t violate the rules.”

  25. Ralph Malph on January 27th, 2005 9:55 am

    The rules say that a fielder is deemed to have entered the game once he “reaches the position usually occupied by the fielder he has replaced, and play commences”. So if a pitch is thrown and Manny is in RF, the umpire should, under the rules, deem him to have entered the game as the RF (and therefore the DH is lost as of then).

    I don’t know that Hargrove would have had a bench coach in 99. I don’t remember hearing about “bench coaches” until the last 2-3 years.

  26. paul mocker on January 27th, 2005 2:46 pm


    Hey Ralph, the history of the bench coach sounds an interesting story