Game 21, White Sox at Mariners

DMZ · April 24, 2006 at 6:20 pm · Filed Under Game Threads 

RHP Jon Garland v LHP Jamie Moyer, 7:05, FSN for TV.

I’m a little curious if Ozzie, who’s got a temper and has some old-time opinions on how to play the game, will find an opportunity to plunk Carl Everett following their war of words. Almost every manager this wouldn’t even be a possibility, but Ozzie? He might go for it.

The two teams have had almost totally different seasons so far. The former World Champions, who I advised people to bet wouldn’t get to 91 wins, have 13 already (gulp). The Mariners, who I thought would be a .500 team, have been nearly as bad as the White Sox have been good. The White Sox have allowed 22 fewer runs and scored 19 more than the Mariners (in two fewer games).

The Mariners, btw, are 0-6 in one run games so far. Ow.


377 Responses to “Game 21, White Sox at Mariners”

  1. LB on April 24th, 2006 10:28 pm

    Next interview: Betancourt will explain why Petagine should PH for Beltre instead of him…

  2. joser on April 24th, 2006 10:30 pm

    So the M’s are now 1-6 in one-run games.

    Bloomquist is very good at this kind of thing and deserves to be used exactly like this whenever the situation comes up — which is exactly what the stat-heads have been suggesting. Stat-heads who, by the way, generally don’t have trouble with subject-verb agreement or use pseudo-words like “your’s”

  3. msb on April 24th, 2006 10:30 pm

    I think it must be Putz’ scary new chin hair that is making all the difference.

  4. dw on April 24th, 2006 10:31 pm

    The irony here is that if Willie hadn’t run for the DH, Hargrove surely would have sent Petagine up to hit for Betancourt. But Willie is the only guy who could play SS if the game continued to the next inning, and most AL managers would rather have a finger cut off than lose their DH.

    In short, we needed a left-handed utility guy, and soon.

  5. rick m on April 24th, 2006 10:32 pm

    How come Eddie always gets to through a fit every time he walks people and gives up homers, but when Garcia did it, it was a sign of immaturity?

  6. John in NV on April 24th, 2006 10:33 pm

    Exciting finish but I have not found this “Moneybag” listed on Amazon yet… Or is it “Money Bag”? And I’d still like to hear more about Val’s view that “time is accelerating.”

  7. LB on April 24th, 2006 10:35 pm

    And in the postgame press conference, Hargrove confirms that his bench coach advised him not to PH for his SS and lose the DH.

  8. Phoenician Todd on April 24th, 2006 10:36 pm

    Well, Rick, Eddie is an experienced veteran with a bull-dog mentality that can deal with adversity and psych himself up to get the next guy.

  9. LB on April 24th, 2006 10:37 pm

    #358: Vetran! Say it right!

  10. msb on April 24th, 2006 10:37 pm

    and possibly it had something to do with Freddy’s tendency to display his emotions while still on the mound, and then carry them into the next inning…..

  11. Phoenician Todd on April 24th, 2006 10:38 pm

    On an unrelated, but still baseball note, I looked at Ichiro’s pitches per PA a few weeks/days ago, and noted that it was up. After his recent successes, I looked again and noticed that is creeping back down. Probably coincidence, but maybe not, and fun for me nonetheless.

  12. rick m on April 24th, 2006 10:40 pm

    Thanks Todd, for a second I suspected a double standard. I’ll bet Carlos Guillen was only encouraging such behavior as well.

  13. John in L.A. on April 24th, 2006 10:46 pm

    Overall, I thought the team looked pretty good today. They got some hits, a nice dose of power, Moyer pitched at the top of Moyer’s game, Willie was used exactly right and excelled, YuBet got to be a hero, which can’t be bad for him. And we won.

    And we did all this without one of our better bats in the line-up and a 2005 deja vu at catcher… bad with the bat and disastrous with the glove.

    I thought the bullpen usage was suspect and Eddie, obviously, was sad. Though he sure seemed to be throwing better.

    I have no idea why the Sox walked Reed to get to YuBet. Loco.

  14. Rain Delay on April 24th, 2006 10:51 pm

    I have no idea why the Sox walked Reed to get to YuBet. Loco.

    Maybe Ozzie thought Grover would pull out Petagine to bat for YuBet, which is Grover’s MO up to this point.

  15. dan on April 24th, 2006 11:00 pm

    #344 if willie shows up to PR in every one run game from now until the end of the season i’ll be pretty happy.

  16. fosio on April 24th, 2006 11:31 pm

    I haven’t read through the game comments, but have to share my opinion. I can live with the Beltre’s and the Sexson’s not living up to their hype, because there are other hitters that can pick up the slack. I cannot, however, deal with a closer that can’t close. I was shocked that they renewed Mr. No Rotator Cuff this off-season. I’m not one that will easily cut bait with someone as I like to give them the benefit of the doubt (and I’m a huge homer, but not enough of one that I can’t see that WFB is good for only PRing and fill-in work and not starting every day), but I see too much Bye-Bye Ayala in him at this point in his career. He just grooves it up to the plate right now — topping out at 89 (at least that’s what I saw). I want my closer to be able to shut people down with a mixture of pitches (one of which being a mid-90’s fastball!), not work the corners with mid-80’s “fastballs”. It’s like Moyer is closing. I’ll admit that Putz scares the bejesus out of me, but it seems like he may have figured some things out – like mixig something else in with a 95-96 mph fastball is good. I wish Soriano could get more work. Guess I wouldn’t mind seeing Putz setting up for Soriano and Eddie elsewhere….

    Sorry for the rant…probably a little post-Hofbrauhaus induced, but heartfelt (and frustrated) nonetheless…even after a WIN!

  17. Mat on April 25th, 2006 1:34 am

    Having now read this thread, what amazes me is how completely irrational people are about judging relief pitchers. At this point in the season, Eddie has thrown 6 and 2/3 innings. He’s blown a whole entire 2 saves so far, and given up the lead in a tie game. He’s looked shaky elsewhere, but it’s still less than seven innings! I understand it can be frustrating to watch while it’s happening, but nothing seems to make people as blindly irrational as relief pitchers.

    In ending, I’ll note that last year, Mariano Rivera blew saves in his first two appearances of the season, against the dreaded Red Sox even, and then went on to blow just two saves the rest of the season. Relief pitchers–walking, talking, small sample sizes.

  18. Zero Gravitas on April 25th, 2006 6:13 am

    BTW this win also made possible by the fact that C-Rex actually managed a hit in the 11th. He also drew a walk in the game. His average stinks, but there are some interesting stats for Crazy Carl right now. He actually leads the team in OBP at .372 and has 15 walks vs. 13 Ks. No one else on the M’s has even 10 walks, and no one else on the team has more walks than strikeouts – most are not even close. In fact, among qualified leaders on the team right now we have 56 walks and 126 strikeouts. Good grief. At least one guy on the team appears to know how to make pitchers work.

  19. davepaisley on April 25th, 2006 6:56 am

    #367 – with any other closer, maybe. But… Eddie G has marginal stuff for a closer, is carrying a shoulder injury and lives on the ragged edge every outing:

    Apr 4, comes into a game with a 5 run lead to “get some work”. Almost coughs up the game.

    Apr 8, comes into a game down 0-3 to get some work. Does OK. Chope ERA in half (to 13.5)

    Apr 12, comes into game with 11-8 lead. Coughs up a run on 3 hits, with one K. Despite the save, several elderly fans die of heart attacks.

    Apr 15, Saves Moyer Boston game with 3-0 lead. Walks leadoff guy, has Varitek fly out deep with one out, making life interesting. Most elderly fans survive as they reach their meds as Gonzalez grounds out to end the game.

    Apr 17, Infamous Boston walk off homer to Loretta. Need I elaborate further on how bad this performance was?

    Apr 20, Walks in losing run. Ditto?

    Apr 24, Coughs up game tying homer to scrub.

    This is not “a rough patch”. Sure, 8 runs in 6.2 innings is just one bad Gil Meche start, but this is the “closer”. The oft-quoted comparison with Mariano Rivera of April 2005 actually looks like this:

    MR Apr 05 2-1 6.2 8 6 2 1 4 6 2.70 1.80 .276
    EG Apr 06 0-2 6.2 10 8 8 3 6 8 10.80 2.40 .357

    While Rivera’s April 05 was definitely rocky (aided by horrible defense it would appear), Guardado’s April 06 is positively rancid.

    This is a guy who can’t pitch any more.

  20. Safeco Hobo on April 25th, 2006 7:54 am

    two observations from last night:

    1. Last night was exactly why WFB should NOT be a starter. His value is a backup infielder and someone who can come in cold and steal a base to set up a run. It sounds so simple, why can’t the rest of the world see this?

    2. I’m sick of the all the traditional TV personalities in the world saying we need a closer who has “guts” and has that certain mind set to close games. I’m pretty sure Soriano’s and Putz’s strikeouts and groundballs work just as good in the 9th as they do in the 7th and 8th! Yes I’m sure the lights are brighter in NY or the Playoffs, but right now the M’s are playing in Seattle with under 20,000 butts in the seats. Why not give Putz or Soriano a shot at saving a few games and give Eddie a chance to prove he CAN get outs? Bullpen by committee always gets a bad rap and i’m sure it would be difficult to go all the way. Beltre wasn’t hitting so you drop him in the order, Eddie isn’t getting outs…..change things up.

  21. Mariner Fan in CO Exile on April 25th, 2006 9:01 am

    I just hope this season doesn’t turn into one where the M’s beat teams they maybe shouldn’t (Chisox – though that was just game 1) and lose to teams they should beat (Rangers). It would be very frustrating to see the promise in the team, but have it squandered in relatively easy series. It would probably delay necessary moves and firings too, which is a bad thing. 12-12 looks pretty good right now. I never thought I’d have to say that again.

  22. adamt on April 25th, 2006 9:51 am

    Re: #344

    I was at Tacoma as well. That 4th inning was brutal and it all started with the error by second base (which, I don’t know if they would have gotten the runner anyway). The pick off attempt (error on the throw) to 2nd base with an 0-2 count was just senseless. Further, giving up a grand slam to a at the time sub-.200 hitter, ouch.

    I didn’t realize it was Jones’ first start in RF but I did notice him out there. It paid off with the very nice relay from Bohn at the wall to cut down the runner at home. Also, Choo is really stroking the ball right now, avg up to .371 now.

  23. rick m on April 25th, 2006 10:10 am


    Also factor in that Eddie’s era for September 2005 was 6.17, and post All Star 4.26.

    What we are seeing here is a trend, and you can bet that if Billy Beane had seen the same trend, and looked at Eddie’s age, there is no way he would have rewarded him with a hefty contract and penned him in as the anchor of our bullpen.

    Why do I care what Beane would do? Because the A’s are our main competition and for the last year the A’s have been beating our brains out at a fraction of the cost.

    You’d think someone in M management would have noticed and pondered why by now.

  24. Sriram on April 25th, 2006 10:18 am

    I never expected I will say this, but we need Kaz Sasaki back – not gonna happen, but Eddie is BAD !!!!

  25. msb on April 25th, 2006 10:47 am

    see #367

  26. Gomez on April 25th, 2006 1:19 pm

    367, 375: see Eddie’s 86-87 mph hanging “fast”ball (which the Safeco gun says is 88-89) Stats don’t account for stuff, and ability to locate for strikes that hitters won’t destroy.

  27. Evan on April 25th, 2006 1:50 pm

    373 – The M’s management proably looks at the A’s and sees a team that has lower revenue and fewer fans. Why would they want to emulate that?

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