Pretty boring Tuesday
DMZ · December 12, 2006 at 10:41 am · Filed Under General baseball
The Red Sox and Boras/Matsuzaka are sparring
Jeff Bagwell might retire today
Rangers get Gagne for a year
Today’s when the M’s will offer arb to arb-eligible players. So we’ll see if Pineiro gets an offer and heck, Broussard for that matter.
[Updated to clip my bafflement at weird ways people use RSS feeds, which ends up looking a lot like plagiarism, which we know too well).]
Hey Derek, can we get a link to the Rangers-Gange story?
Jeff Cirillo is also a Twin!
Jeff Cirillo is also a Twin!
Hey now we can throw tomatoes and bottles at him when the Twins come to Seattle! Yeah!
Sorry for the non-comment.
I like the Rangers deal with Gagne — $6M for one year sounds like a good bet to me. Without Soriano, I would have been fired up if the M’s signed that deal.
I wonder whether they are projecting Gagne as the closer?
What are you trying to say MarinerDan?
Yeah amazingly if we signed him to the same contract as the Rangers did and non-tendered Pineiro then we’d actually make half a million dollars. How’s that for a statement? OH YEAH!
I am a huge Gagne fan (so much so that I wasted a relatively high pick on him in my fantasy draft last year believing that he would be back to normal last year). Once again, I am optimistic that he will be healthy. If so, he has to be a good bet to be one of the better closers in the league, even allowing that he will not return to his Cy Young-domination days.
The big question mark is his health, but I think it was a very reasonable flier for the Rangers to take. I also like the Lofton deal the Rangers signed — replacing Sarge Jr. with Lofton, to me at least, is not that much of a downgrade and represent SIGNIFICANTLY less risk and cost.
Lets see for Arbitration, the Mariners will… non-tender and non-tebder. That’s my prediction.
how about Hickey’s proposal this morning to swap Reed for Haren?
I would tender an offer to Broussard. Even if the M’s decide that they do not have room for him, he might fetch a bullpen arm in a deal with an AL team needing a lefty hitter. Pineiro, no.
Since Reed will have no place with the M’s, either starting or on the bench, I would love to see that trade occur.
The only way a Reed for Haren deal goes down is if the M’s and A’s switch GMs prior to the deal.
I don’t think there’s any danger of us not tendering Broussard.
“Sure, we’ll let you have Haren for Reed. But since you thought Soriano for Ramirez was a good deal, we’ll need King Felix as a throw-in.”
Now this is a rumor I can get behind.
If not Haren, which I would like to see happen, but is unlikely, maybe package Reed to the Rox for Jennings, whom Hickey also mentions as a target for the M’s.
I’d like to see Reed for Haren. Perhaps we can make it a two-for-two and give Oakland Reed and Broussard for Swisher and Haren. They might even throw in that “Harden” guy.
No way that a Reed for Haren deal happens.
14. This is the sneaky little whispered problem now for the M’s. Since most everyone sees the Soriano for Ramirez deal as such a lopsided deal for the Braves…every GM is going to throw out crazy deals hoping to catch the same luck and get Bavasi to bite. Nothing will come easy now!
“Pretty boring Tuesday” You’re seeing the glass as half-empty. I prefer to view things this way: It’s a perfectly wonderful Tuesday because we haven’t any senseless trades or free agent signings! (Yes, Mariner fans have been reduced to this.)
boy, ESPN is sure on the MecheWagon…. “With the signing of right-hander Gil Meche, Royals general manager Dayton Moore has sent a strong message about his desire to improve the moribund franchise. Jerry Crasnick explains”
Oh, he’s sent a strong message, alright. Just not the one he thinks he’s sending.
Honestly, Hickey looks like a complete idiot here. Who in their right mind could even think about a Reed-for-Haren swap and keep a straight face? After that deal is complete, we’ll put the finishing touches on our Broussard-for-Teixeira swap…then Sexson-for-Verlander since, you know, the Tigers are looking for power hitters and all.
Anybody else notice that Hickey said Ichiro moved from LEFT to center? I don’t think Ichiro has played left once, has he? Unless he did in the playoffs when Buhner played right his last year.
re: Matsuzaka, the NYTimes had an interesting quote:
“Japanese reporters said it would be awkward for Matsuzaka if he had to return to Japan. Matsuzaka has already said goodbye to his country, and the financially strapped Lions were expecting a significant payday after posting him. If Boras requests as much as $15 million a year and the Red Sox counter with $10 million, people in Japan would wonder why the lower amount was not enough.
“Nobody in Japan is expecting him to come back because the negotiations broke down,†said Yasuko Yanagita, a reporter for the Hochi Shimbun. “I don’t think this is only for the Japanese culture. But in Japan, someone asking for ‘money, money, money’ does not leave a good impression.—
Yeah, it must be your culture. We expect our athletes to be all about the money.
And we then trash them for it. It doesn’t leave a good impression here, either; the athletes are just more willing to thumb their noses at that.
24 brings up an interesting point. I am fascinated to see how this plays out with the RedSox and Matsuzaka with the clock ticking and no deal in place. For someone who culturally might not want to be perceived as chasing the highest dollar, he sure made an interesting choice of agents. What an extremely awkward situation for everyone involved if he has to go back to Japan – and imagine the angst this would generate in Boston.
But didn’t one of the authors propose pursuing this guy after the Red Sox deal fell through? Apparently, the Mariners didn’t win the bidding war for Iricho but he wanted to play for them, so it was arranged. Can’t that happen here?
So, Bagwell… HoFer? First ballot?
#29 — I think so. His name hasn’t come up in the steroid scandal (I don’t believe), despite his proximity to Ken Caminiti. His numbers certainly are there. Therefore, in my opinion, he is a HoFer on the first ballot. Plus, he was cool.
#28– Apparently, the Mariners didn’t win the bidding war for Iricho but he wanted to play for them, so it was arranged.
huh?!
Ichiro wanted . . the M’s didn’t . . it was arra . . oh, good grief.
#28– if this helps:
M’s bid $13,125,000M
Dodgers’ bid between $9-10M
New York Mets bid between $6-7M
New York Yankees, Boston Red Sox & Toronto Blue Jays bid $5M+
Okay, maybe that was it. I just remember a discussion where it was stated that submitting the highest posting fee didn’t make necessarily make it a done deal. I looked through the past comments and I guess our posting bid was a lot higher than everybody else’s. And Ichiro wanted to come here. So maybe it was something like making the winning bid doesn’t guarantee you’ll the get the player because he could change his mind, as in this case.
huh.
strength & conditioning coach, maybe, but manager??
Like it takes any special skill to manage. Remember the potted plant hypothesis?
29. I doubt it. If he goes in so will Edger and maybe Mo Vaughn who I doubt will get in at all.
37 — Mo is not anywhere near Edgar or Bagwell.
Edgar doesn’t quite match Bagwell, numbers-wise, at least what will be considered by the voters. Bagwell is at .297/.408/.540 and ‘Gar is at .312/.418/.515. Pretty similar. Bagwell is at .323 EQA, Edgar at .329. Close, but slight edge to ‘Gar.
Here is the difference (in the mind of the voters): 449/1529 for Bagwell and 309/1219 for ‘Gar. Not close in the categories most voters will look to. And neither has much of an advantage in terms of home ball parks — remember, Bagwell played in the Astrodome before the bandbox. And Edgar played in the Kingdome.
I think both should be in.
Unfortunately, Bagwell will get in first ballot and Edgar likely won’t. (Not to mention, of course, that Edgar was a DH.)
I actually cheated ‘Gar — he finished with 1261 RBI (and 1219 runs). Conclusion still stands, though.
Mo had a fine career. He hit almost .300 and had more homeruns than ‘Gar. He’s close to Edgar but not Bagwell.
Plagarism is alive and well. Wow – you would think it would give a link as a credit at the very least.
My son is doing a paper on baseball strategy at school. Do you have anything in about the 2,000 word size available?
Fine career, yes, but not up to Edgar. Compare EQA: .308 to .329.
Doing my part for cut-and-paste plagiarism:
The Astros have acquired right-hander Jason Jennings from the Rockies. The Rockies will receive center fielder Willy Taveras and right-handers Jason Hirsh and Taylor Buchholz for Jennings and right-hander Miguel Asencio, major-league sources said.
(Fox Sports)
38
God love Edgar, but at as player he was no Jeff Bagwell. Bags featured a rare combo of speed and defense rarely seen in a firstbaseman to go along with his stellar numbers.
Who the hell knows who’ll get in the hall if McGwire is any indicator. It wouldn’t surprise me if Bagwell, who is one of the best firstbasemen of all time, was bypassed for hitting less than .300 while *only* hitting +/- 450 HRs considering the era he played in.
Sounds like a good deal for the Rox. I’m not sure we could/should have matched that package (and I don’t like Taveras).
If Boston and Matsuzaka don’t reach a deal, I think that Boras simply declares Matsuzaka to be a free agent and invites bids from MLB teams.
If MLB teams don’t bid, Boras begins the work to file an anti-trust lawsuit for owner collusion. (Remember that MLB does not have anti-trust exemption on labor matters.)
I think Boras has an excellent case; the only authority that baseball has to limit the ability of free agents to sign with teams is through the collective bargaining process. The amateur draft is legally viable only because it is part of the Collective Bargaining Agreement.
The posting process was not negotiated with the Players Association. Without having been negotiated with the Players Association, under US law I think it collapses almost immediately when challenged as an anti-competitive restraint of trade. MLB exposes itself to treble damages, based on the income that Matsuzaka doesn’t receive, which could also include promotional and endorsement opportunities.
When put into a US court of law, I think the court pretty quickly concludes that Matusuzaka has the same rights as any international player outside the US and Canada; he can come to the US as an unrestricted free agent and the posting agreement is unenforceable in the US.
Sadly, I think Edgar only gets in when the HOF voters decide that (after the position has existed for more than a quarter of the AL and MLB’s history) the DH deserves to be recognised.
I’m not convinced that Bagwell will get in first-ballot. He doesn’t have the kind of crazy stupid counting stats (no 500 HR) that motivate enough of the writers to generation a first-ballot entry. But he’s pretty clearly a strong candidate and will make it in.
46: It’s my impression that Boras wants to continue to work with MLB negotiating contracts more than he wants to sacrifice his career on the altar of labor rights. I doubt your scenario comes to pass the way you outline.
#48 — I think you are not taking into account the climate the voters will be making their decision in. Bagwell is “taint-free” so his numbers look all the better against his contemporaries. Take away McGwire/Bonds/Sosa/Palmeiro/etc., and Bags has first-rate numbers from this era.
46: It’s my impression that Boras wants to continue to work with MLB negotiating contracts more than he wants to sacrifice his career on the altar of labor rights. I doubt your scenario comes to pass the way you outline.
And how would he sacrifice his career if he takes MLB to court on Matsuzaka? Players are certainly not going to avoid him and I can’t see how he can be more hated than he is now by management.
Also, wouldn’t Japanese law be at play as well? I mean, assumably Matsuzaka isn’t going to defect to the U.S., so someone has to buy out his contract from Seibu. I’ve read these postulations that Boras might do that, but I can’t believe that would really play out that way. MLB has enough power to keep him from assuming that extreme of a role, I think.
What about Olerud? Career avg. of .295 255 HRs .398 OBP .995 Fielding pct.
If Boston and Matsuzaka don’t reach a deal, I think that Boras simply declares Matsuzaka to be a free agent and invites bids from MLB teams.
You might want to check with the Seibu Lions on that one.
Think HoF voters will recognize that Bagwell spent much of his career in the Astrodome and Edgar spent most of his in the Kingdome? Probably not, but they likely will look at the fact that Bagwell had about 150 more Home Runs and Steals than Edgar. The MVP award will help Bagwell too.
54: You might want to check with the Seibu Lions on that one.
Let’s assume Matsuzaka is in the US. Whatever rights Seibu has to Matsuzaka are under Japanese law, between a Japanese entity and a Japanese citizen. No US court is going to even attempt to enforce that contract.
More to the point, I think a US court is going to look at this and see a person who has a profession, and a group of employers is colluding not to employ him.
I think a US court is going to have a hard time accepting a situation where a group of owners can unilaterally decide to blackball a certain player or group of players. IIRC, the Connie Hawkins settled that case for professional athletes.
Um, yeah. US baseball owners are going to create an international incident and potentially cut off one of their best talent sources (and markets) by taking Japanese baseball owners to court over the posting system. Um, no.
If this group of employers were truly colluding not to employ him, why did they even bid for his services? In your opinion, the owners are unilaterally blackballing him. That’s a bold statement.
Just my opinion, but I think you’re jumping to rash conclusions with little or no evidence about how courts might rule.
46 — eh, not really. No court is going to rule that a Japanese club has to burn its posting contract on the altar of US antitrust law. If Boston doesn’t sign Matsuzaka, the posting fee comes back, and the Japanese player contract resumes.
Also, its possibly an overstatement to say that the antitrust exemption doesn’t apply to labor matters, as it is widely conceded that the minor leagues — including the nonunionized player contracts — are being run in a manner that is inconsistent with the Sherman Act. As I understand it, no Court has taken up the issue.
Putting the legal issue aside, every time Scott Boras gets involved with an issue, my stomach churns.
#46– here you go:
“October 05, 2005 — The Global Reach of America’s Pastime: Antitrust Implications of the US-Japanese Player Contract Agreement”
#56 tell that to Palmeiro.
If MLB teams don’t bid, Boras begins the work to file an anti-trust lawsuit for owner collusion. (Remember that MLB does not have anti-trust exemption on labor matters.)
From the Curt Flood Act of 1998:
That language seems pretty clear that you need to be, or have been, in the majors already for the law to apply. Matsuzaka isn’t there yet, even if he undoubtedly will be in the end. So the labor exemption to the antitrust exemption looks like it’s incomplete.
Let’s assume Matsuzaka is in the US. Whatever rights Seibu has to Matsuzaka are under Japanese law, between a Japanese entity and a Japanese citizen. No US court is going to even attempt to enforce that contract.
Oh, my bad, Matsuzaka is totally going to break his contract with the Lions, in a completely dishonorable way, in order to sign with someone other than the Red Sox. You’re right, that’s soooo plausible.
57: US baseball owners are going to create an international incident and potentially cut off one of their best talent sources (and markets) by taking Japanese baseball owners to court over the posting system. Um, no.
It’s not US owners that take go to court. It’s Boras that goes to court.
#58: If this group of employers were truly colluding not to employ him, why did they even bid for his services? In your opinion, the owners are unilaterally blackballing him. That’s a bold statement.
Let’s say that Boras brings Matsuzaka to the US without a contract. Boras announces Matsuzaka is ready to play for any MLB and wants to negotiate a contract. But no teams put in offers because they have all agreed among themselves to not to bid on NPB players outside the posting process.
That’s about as clear a case of collusion as you could get. The only question is whether the posting agreement somehow makes it possible for teams to collude in that fashion.
And that’s where I contend the posting process fails. Teams do limit the ability of a player to sign with any team in the amateur draft, but that is only because the amateur draft has been negotiated in the Collective Bargaining Agreement. If the draft weren’t in the Bargaining Agreement, the MLB couldn’t run the draft because they would run afoul of anti-trust.
***
MLB simply does not have the right to unilaterally limit the ability of any player to sign with whatever MLB team the player wants without negotiating that limitation with the MLBPA. Any attempt to do so immediately puts baseball afoul of antitrust laws.
The posting process is a limit on the freedom of the player to sign with an MLB team, imposed without going through collective bargaining. I can’t see how it can survive antitrust muster.
I think Boras knows it, and he knows he has the power. Baseball has to come to him if it wants to preserve the Posting Agreement. If they don’t come to him, he simply pulls out the toothpick at the bottom of the stack and watches the whole thing come crashing down.
Here is what Batista told Bavasi..and Bavasi agreed I guess….3 years to an old guy…locking up a rotation spot and more money for the future…goooooood call
“The first thing I told him is, ‘Let’s get this out of the way right now: I don’t pitch with my birth certificate, so don’t bring up my age,”‘ he said. “I’ve only been hurt once in my entire career. You can rely on me because I will always be there to take the ball.”
The player is under contract in Japan and therefore is not a free entity. If a Major league player wants to go to a praticuliar team and is under contract to another, it’s not the player who chooses where he’ll go. If the team he was under contract with followed the posting process in order to trade away thier player I think people might think it odd, but none would argue against the teams ability and right to trade (or not) a player under club control.
MLB simply does not have the right to unilaterally limit the ability of any player to sign with whatever MLB team the player wants without negotiating that limitation with the MLBPA. Any attempt to do so immediately puts baseball afoul of antitrust laws.
Steve, you might want to read my post above, and think about whether or not your position was already refuted before you posted. Or you might want to rephrase your position to make it more defensible – in which case it probably wouldn’t cover Matsuzaka’s situation anymore.
Let’s assume Matsuzaka is in the US. Whatever rights Seibu has to Matsuzaka are under Japanese law, between a Japanese entity and a Japanese citizen. No US court is going to even attempt to enforce that contrac
Uh, I don’t think contract law quite works that way, but I don’t even play a lawyer on TV, let alone baseball-related message boards. It does seem to me the way standing is invoked is that the baseball club that Japanese citizen is going to sign with is based in the US or Canada- and that your Japense entity asks for an injunction against allowing that club from entering into an agreement with your ballplayer that infringes on YOUR contractual rights, so I’m not sure your scenario’s relevant.
Maybe they’ll take Matsuzaka to the WTO for arbitration.
Speaking of HoFers has Rickey Henderson even announced his official retirement yet? If I was him I would announce it ASAP.
Let’s assume Matsuzaka is in the US. Whatever rights Seibu has to Matsuzaka are under Japanese law, between a Japanese entity and a Japanese citizen. No US court is going to even attempt to enforce that contract.
No, that’s not right. US courts enforce contracts entered into by foreign parties in a foreign country all the time. If the US-Japan player contract agreement is part of the standard Japanese player contract which Matsuzaka signed, then he is bound by it.
Now, maybe the contract complied with Japanese antitrust law but not with US antitrust law. Then you get into a tricky conflict of laws issue. There is a complex body of law which tells courts how to figure out those kind of disputes, and you can’t come up with the answer to that off the top of your head without knowing the law.
So all of this speculation isn’t worth a damn, unless somebody wants to go out and read the cases and give an informed opinion. I don’t feel like spending the time.
Apparently Gillick really wanted Bobby Livingston back.
The upshot of all this is that the legal ramifications is not as clear cut as many of the non-lawyers say it is….
Say, if Boras and $25 million willessentially buys up Matsuzaka’s contract from Seibu, then that WILL sidestep many questions (and if Seibu agrees to it, then he’s free and clear from the Japanese side).
Posted players ask to be posted, which in my way of thinking waives thier right to complain afterward about the process as long as it’s played out according to the written guidelines.
Gwangung: I agree that there would probably be no problem with this as long as the Red Sox didn’t decide to take Boras to court with the thought that he was not bargaining in good faith with them. If this were his plan all along then the Red Sox would have a lot of hours they should be able to bill to him.
Posted players ask to be posted, which in my way of thinking waives thier right to complain afterward about the process as long as it’s played out according to the written guidelines.
It depends on the Japanese and US laws, which it seems few of us here know (and I doubt that many MLB lawyers are that conversant on). All sorts of ways around it (Boras purchases the Seibu contract personally, etc.).
Gwangung: I agree that there would probably be no problem with this as long as the Red Sox didn’t decide to take Boras to court with the thought that he was not bargaining in good faith with them.
THAT might be hard to establish in court, I think; it would just as easily could be show that the Bosox were not bargaining in good faith…particularly if Boras got inquiries with terms above what the Sox were offering.
Speaking of HoFers has Rickey Henderson even announced his official retirement yet?
Yes, and it wouldn’t matter – eligibility starts from when he stopped playing, not when he announces he’s stopped playing.
Is all Rickeys baggage enough to keep him from being first ballot
Only for complete idiots, IMAO.
Then again, we’re talking about sportswriters….
Is all Rickeys baggage enough to keep him from being first ballot
No way. Rickey is a sure-fire first ballot HoFer. No question.
I wonder what hat he would wear. The A’s?
Whatever issues writers have with Rickey, it’s hard to imagine it’s enough to keep him from being an easy first-ballot pick.
Ought to be A’s, and I can’t see how anyone would say Rickey shouldn’t be in the hall of fame. The question was if there’s been a perception change on whether players who have the credentials aren’t automatically going to be voted for without the mental background check that if disqualifying players like McGwire might lose alot of votes for Henderson.
I can’t wait for Rickey’s entirely third person HoF speech in which he congratulates Rickey for making the Hall.
This is OT, but since this is a general post… [deleted, ot]
Wasn’t it Bill Simmons who came up with the “Kareem Corollary” or some such idea? The gist is that even the most despised players can hang around long enough and inexplicably become beloved. Me thinks Rickey would apply here. He was arguably the most hated athlete in sports for a time in the 1991-92 timeframe (his “if you pay me like Mike Gallego, I’ll hit like Mike Gallego” comment was one of my faves, along with his “I’m the Greatest” speech, etc.) But, by 2001, sportswriters were openly wondering why he wasn’t getting more press for breaking the all-time runs scored record. His weird little journey through independent league outposts in Newark and San Diego only added to the softening of his image.
First ballot HOFer, easily.
If some MLB team ignores Matsuzaka’s contract and signs him, couldn’t the Lions 1) sue Matsuzaka for breach of contract; and 2) sue the MLB team for tortious interference with a contract?
I’d think any “collusion” charges could be avoided by the MLB teams simply pointing out that Matsuzaka was already bound by a contract, and didn’t want to get sued by the Lions.
sports are exempt from antitrust law
No, they’re not. Please, try to look into these things before you make blanket statements like that. Thanks.
#86 — I don’t think Rickey was even the most disliked player on his team. Canseco had already been flashing his freak credentials by that point.
By the way, your most highly paid player of 1992: Danny Tartabull.
Are there any M’s deals left for the offseason? It’s like getting amped for the superbowl and then the team you’re rooting for gets blown out in the first half.
I would consider it a successful offseason at this point if they could just dump Sexson’s salary on somebody else. I would consider it a fantastic offseason (regardless of the #of wins this season) if they could dump both Sexson and Washburn onto another teams payroll.
caller on the radio is not thrilled with Batisita.
“whats wrong with Zito? What’s wrong with giving him $12M a year? [um, because he wouldn't take it?] But that’s the Mariners, always trying to do it on the cheap”
sigh.
If Rickey doesn’t get in on the first ballot, then they should remove the BBWAA from the voting process for the Hall.
A more interesting question will be whether Craig Biggio will get in or not. Bill James had him rated ridiculously high in his last Historical Baseball Abstract, and his similar batters list is just insane:
1. Robin Yount (831) *
2. Joe Morgan (817) *
3. Roberto Alomar (816)
4. Lou Whitaker (776)
5. Paul Molitor (776) *
6. Ryne Sandberg (765) *
7. Cal Ripken (753)
8. Charlie Gehringer (751) *
9. Brooks Robinson (741) *
10. Vada Pinson (732)
I think he’s in, though it will be a couple of ballots before he gets his plaque.
Oh, and I think Bagwell is a second ballot HoFer.
Around the world in a day with Bobby Livingston:
PHILADELPHIA — The Phillies acquired a potential No. 1 starter in Freddy Garcia during last week’s Winter Meetings. On Tuesday, they took another step in bolstering their depth at the position.
Left-hander Bobby Livingston was acquired by the Phillies from the Devil Rays for cash considerations. The Devil Rays had claimed Livingston off waivers from the Mariners earlier in the day.
Joel has been non-tendered.
95. Woo-hoo! Hopefully they don’t offer him a contract and we’ll finally be free from Joel “Terrible pitcher” Pineiro.
I have to turn the radio off. First the caller who was complaining that the Mariners never go after big time free agents and no, Beltre & Sexson don’t count, and if they’d offered any money to Schmidt he would have come to Seattle because he’d rather play for Seattle than the Dodgers [yeah, stupid NL playoff team] so he knows they’ll never try for Zito. This was followed by Gas who opined that Sexson has put up great numbers and well, Beltre, he has been a good defender….
I have to turn the radio off.
Why turn it on in the first place. It’s not like sports talk radio is the National Enquirer, which you can see accidently in the checkout line.
argh. didn’t get to the radio fast enough. Now it’s the guy who thinks that Batista has no upside, and gosh, at least Pineiro has upside.
From Seattle Mariners web site:
Assuming any of those teams return his agent’s calls.
If you butter Pineiro on his chest and drop him off the kitchen counter, he will land on his upside nine times of ten.
#98– oh, this time of day it’s usually that I still haven’t switched away from tuning in for the vent line, the one bright spot of the afternoon.
and speaking of Quality Sports Radio, the Mariner hot stove league is on tonight
Assuming any of those teams return his agent’s calls
Assuming he has an agent.
#100– you must have missed Matthew Pouliot, who thinks “the Red Sox might look outside the box for a closer, with Joel Pineiro and Tony Armas Jr. two of the possibilities.”
You should definitely write a post on this Derek.
If the BoSox sign Pineiro to be their closer prepare for the “Curse of the Bambino” part deux.
Here’s a question, do we sign Marcus Giles if we trade Beltre?
from Rotoworld: “The Red Sox wanted to make sure they’re desire to land Matsuzaka is being communicated to the right-hander. However, Boras is insisting that everything be funneled through him, and what’s getting through to the player remains a mystery to the team.”
sounds familiar.
I hate Boras. I wonder how many contracts he has ruined due to him holding out for bigger and bigger money?
Zero.
People keep on looking at Boras from the team’s perspective.
People have GOT to remember that Boras works for the PLAYER. And there are damn few, if any, players who didn’t get close to the maximum they could have gotten.
And, we should point out, that does happen: Alex Rodriguez signed two deals with the M’s though Boras thought he could get more, all the way to Andruw Jones’ last deal with Atlanta.
#64: Look at this from the point of view of the MLBPA: is it in the best interest of its members to have every ballplayer in NPB an unrestricted MLB free agent?
#112: It seems that when the rubber finally hits the road, though, some players forget exactly who is working for whom. From ESPN Insider today: Link
A few months after Alex Rodriguez signed his $252 million contract with the Texas Rangers, a deal negotiated by Boras, A-Rod was quoted in a New York newspaper as saying that he had really hoped to sign with the Mets. That seemed utterly bizarre, and a little silly: A-Rod had more negotiating leverage than any player in the history of baseball and yet he wound up playing someplace other than where he wanted to play. He could’ve played for the Mets – maybe not for $252 million, but maybe for $200 million. The difference between his playing for the Mets or not playing for the Mets was a whole lot of numbers on bank statements. (Excerpt short enough for fair use, I hope.)
Boras is basically saying the player shouldn’t be penalized because the team is paying a posting fee – the player doesn’t see a dime of the posting fee. The one comment I read from Epstein was saying in effect, well we do think he’s a 100m$ pitcher, which is reflected in the amount we pay in the posting fee (or something like that). If I’m the player’s agent, that’s not what I want to hear. The Sox should have realized they couldn’t offer Matsuzaka a discounted contract just because of the posting fee. It’s hilarious that Boras is mentioning Gil Meche’s contract today to illustrate his point.
#11: Boras can say whatever he wants. It’s his job to pump up the contract.
Of course, Matsuzaka has to accept a discount, because he is not a free agent. If Matsuzaka’s salary couldn’t be discounted, then the only appropriate bid to post for him would be $0. (Conversion to yen is an exercise for the reader.)
Jered Weaver doesn’t make “Meche money” because he’s not a free agent.
Johan Santana doesn’t make “Meche money” because he’s not a free agent.
Felix Hernandez doesn’t make “Meche money” because he’s not a free agent.
Like all of these pitchers, Matsuzaka is under club control. Unlike all of these pitchers, Matsuzaka has never thrown a pitch in major leage baseball.
Or, to say it another way, both Matsuzaka AND the Red Sox are paying Seibu the posting fee to allow Matsuzaka out of his 10 year obligation before free agency, so the Red Sox are correct in including the cost of the posting fee in the total negotiated amount.
What other way could Matsuzaka get Seibu to let him loose before the 10 years are up? Retiring is out; Nomo’s end-around closed that loophole.
If Boras’ next ploy is to have posted Japanese players return to Japan and demand the equivalent of their posted fee in a re-worked contract for the remainder of their 10 year obligation….well, good luck, Scotty.