Game 145, Devil Rays at Mariners
I’m glad to see a new opponent, that’s for sure. Jason Hammel, one of a bunch of more or less interchangable, cheap, back-of-the-rotation guys the Devil Rays have been juggling (and who I traded to Jason in our hyper-complicated keeper-league-of-keeper-leagues), faces off against Jeff Weaver, who’s been getting cuffed around since that pretty good August 12th game against a weak White Sox team.
Jeff Weaver, last 5 starts: 2-2, 7.62 ERA, 26 IP, 37 H, 6 BB, 15 K, 9 HR. Opponents: .346/.371/.664
season: 6-12 in 23 starts, 6.05 ERA, 125 IP, 164 H, 30 BB, 69 K, 19 HR. Opponents: .319/.358/.523
Jason Hammel, in 10 starts: 1-4, 6.75 ERA, 45.1 IP, 53 H, 19 BB, 27 K, 9 HR. Opponents: .293/.366/.547
Weaver makes approximately $8m more than Hammel.
Not playing: Adam Jones. Apparently, there is no way to play yourself into the lineup under McLaren: there’s no playing time to be had if you don’t perform up to an undefined standard, and spectacular performances are only rewarded with continued playing time if you’re a veteran.
How is this supposed to motivate anyone?
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This is almost seems like a good night for Hammel to throw a 3 hit shutout in that case since he’s playing the Mariners. Hope I’m wrong. . .
“The Seattle Mariners are vying for a playoff spot while the Tampa Bay Devil Rays are likely headed for another 90-loss season. Still, there’s no question which team has been better lately.”
sigh.
The real question is “Does Adam Jones earn a lineup spot”.
As much as I favor veterans and don’t really see a great future for Adam Jones, it’s been known that struggling, really-should-be-sitting veterans have earned a spot in a game with one swing of the bat. Does the same rule apply to Jones?
If he’s not playing, I would take it as “a sign” if I were Jones.
Some people just sometimes forget that once upon a time these “veterans” you see know were rookies trying to find their way like Adam Jones. And those rookies certainly didn’t get a chance to become better by being bench warmers.
Poor Adam, I hope he’s up here playing 3 times a week next year under Joe Girardi.
now*
#1– let’s see.
a young righthander they have never seen vs. the pitcher who has since his last win has “surrendered 15 earned runs and 25 hits in three starts over 12 1-3 innings”
#6: Yup. Another reason not to watch, so sad. Four irrevelant Septembers in a row under Bill Bavasi.
Please don’t tell me that’s good enough to warrant an extension.
*irrelevant
Ack, bad spelling, sorry.
Please, would you maybe consider proofing your comments before submitting, given that you’re running a 50% correction rate?
Adam Jones, last 17 plate appearances: .400/.438/.867, 3 of his 6 hits have been for extra bases, plus a walk and only two strikeouts.
By Geoff Baker’s definition, Adam Jones is too hot to take out of the line-up for another week or two before we’re completely sure he’s cooled off. Oh, wait, apparently that only applies to crappy guys over 30.
As the resident Rays fan (yes, we do exist), I thought I’d chime in on Hammel. Basically, if he keeps the ball low in the zone, he’s good. If he doesn’t, he’s bad. Unfortunately, he’s done the former more this season and it’s hurt him. He does have good stuff, though, and the talent to be a quality MLB pitcher. He throws in the low-90s and can get it into the mid-90s, with an average slider and above average curve, but doesn’t locate them well most of the time.
As for the team itself, they definitely have played better lately, although they could of very easily swept Boston at Fenway, and managed to blow the final two games. What’s amazing is that, as bad as the Rays have been record wise, they have two studs at the top of the rotation in Kazmir in Shields. Both sport 12-8 records, both have excellent peripherals, and both maintain excellent ratios (for the most part). The team has a ton of young talent, and they’ve just recently started to play consistently to their ability. It won’t be long before the team is a respectable major league franchise, and they are going to surprise some people in the upcoming years.
JMHO, of course. Good luck tonight. I’ll occasionally chime in during the game.
wasn’t it Shields that Dave thought would be a good pick-up?
#9: haha, I type fast, that’s the problem. . .
Remind me, to whom should we direct correspondence regarding our, ahem, “unhappiness” with McLaren?
12 – No, it was J.P. Howell. I was an advocate of picking up Shields, but Dave said that Shields is completely off-limits.
Maybe he was talking about Scot Shields? Tampa would never trade James Shields. He’s a strike throwing, innings eating machine. And his changeup is godly.
What Dave said in #10. Damn straight.
I’m not going to bother watching this game. I can do other things. The season is over. Why not get players like AJ in ??? … at least *then* there would be a reason to watch.
Good god, I didn’t even notice the Rays lineup tonight. Velandia, Guzman, Casanova, and Norton? That’s pathetic.
I read in Geoff Baker’s blog they are letting Bavasi come back next year as of now. . .
Time to pack it in for ’08, as of now.
And on another note: the Yankees finally managed to lose a game.
#18: That lineup would be bad even in 1999 when every one of them except Guzman were up in the big leagues.
#10: Bat Adam lead-off next year!!!
And Guzman has more holes in his swing than swiss cheese. Not to mention, his defense can’t hold a candle to Iwamura’s. That lineup is just awful.
#23: Which means Weaver will give up about 4 runs on 10 hits and 3 BB through 6+ innings.
We only need Tom to start giving us traffic reports in McCall, ID to complete the Corco cloning experiment.
#3
“As much as I favor veterans and don’t really see a great future for Adam Jones”
Please just pack it up. If I wanted to read tripe, I would read the PI Blog…
Earth to the Mariner ownership –
The people that you hire to run your organization hire like minded people. Thats the way businesses work. McClaren, who doesn’t understand how to effectively manage (successful managing doesn’t involve creating friendships with subordinates, it involves demanding respect from them – respect that is earned through competent decisions and success, both of which aren’t occuring now), is a subordinate of Bavasi, who in turn is of Lincoln and Armstrong.
Don’t look now but your apple is rotten at the core and your profits won’t taste so delicious in the near future.
OMG!!! Hammel went to South Kitsap!!!! OMGYG2BK!!!!!
I know that BA is NOT a good indicator of whether a player is a good hitter or not …
but just for fun, the Mariners ENTIRE line-up tonight does not sport one person batting under .280 for the season.
[Sims]
If the M’s don’t beat a tired D-Rays team, I don’t know how they can still spin a “we are still in it” line to the press and fans.
Wow, Carlos Pena has 39 HRs.
Entering this season, who would you have rather had: Carlos Pena or Hee Seop Choi? They were ranked about equal (as in “equally undesirable”) … funny how one exploded and one disappeared.
#30 – a lot of the lineup? I thought it was just Sexson still hurt, so Broussard at first, Lopez still in the doghouse, so WFB at second.
Resting who, exactly?
#31– well, match the way they hit vs a non-tired Hammels…
Interesting how Tampa Bay has decided not to worry about Delmon Young’s power shortcomings and just leave him alone. A lot of teams could learn from that.
#34 — The D-Rays are the ones who are resting, and still able to score on Weaver in the 1st.
Looks like tonight may be a vintage Weaver night. We all better pray for the offense.
20 pitches for Weaver. Is it possible for an M’s pitcher, particularly a starter, to get out of an inning without using over 15 pitches?
Delmon will hit for more power as soon as he stops being so aggressive at the plate. His power is phenomenal, but it’s hard to get good swings on the ball when you swing at every thing.
Looks like tonight may be a vintage Weaver night. We all better pray for some offense.
And yea, I have no idea why AJ isn’t be in the line up. My god Mac is a SFB.
If you’ll recall, a couple of years ago, at our Safeco Q&A with Bavasi, I asked him about why he chose Carl Everett over guys like Carlos Pena who was a younger, cheaper, similar type of hitter with upside.
Bavasi talked about how Pena couldn’t hit in the middle of an order and Carl Everett could.
That was fun.
Ichiro’s throw was… “Just a bit outside”. Was pretty far off the mark on the play at home.
Did Ichiro just swing at two balls 2 inches off the ground? Gameday says yes.
Dave – I am sure Bavasi is regretting that decision now…and for some reason FO still hasn’t figured out that playing people with talent rather than crappy veterans is how to win games.
But Mac IS giving chances! Look, he started Willie! Because he HUSTLES!
apparently, Hammel is yet another Mariner ‘draft and follow’ pitcher
34 The Rays are resting. They got in at 4am, although maybe the Ms were out celebrating their ‘playoff like’ win until 4 also.
#46– I thought he was starting Willie B because everyone know those Port Orchard hitters just kill Port Orchard pitchers.
Despite Guillen’s single, I still have no idea why he bats fourth against a righty.
Dave and Rick were just explaining why JMac is
such a genius and it’s working out just great
to never play the young ones, ever, ever, ever.
Because “you never know what can happen” and
you “have to ride the ones that got them here”
etc. etc. etc.
I want to beat my head against a wall.
MLB.com gameday took away the strikezone box around homeplate and the batter. Did umps complain about called strikes and balls that did not align with the Gameday version of the strikezone?
#37 – my bad. It’s easy to lose track of who’s traveling where when you’re in Hawaii
Interesting to see that coolstandings.com has the AL all stitched up (all top 4 teams have playoff percentages over 95%) and Detroit, the 5th team is at a mere 6.9%, while the NL still has 8 teams with double digit chances (down to LA at 10%).
So the M’s announcers are till scoreboard watching? They must be excited that NYY and LAA both lost today.
Per usual with Hammel, if he locates well, he’s good, if he doesn’t, he gets hit hard.
I’m sure the Ms announcers have been told to pretend the team is still in the pennant race.
sadly, watching Blow illustrate pitches is more interesting than watching Weaver pitch.
I just dropped in here to ask a question, as I stopped following games when Rick White stepped onto the field in Cleveland — and that’s from someone who watched or at least listened to games right through the end of September the past three years. I’m still reading the “post season” posts, but the game threads… ugh. But it’s the only way I can ask an off-topic question… and it actually relates to that game in Cleveland as well as last night — the two games where Jones hit HRs. My understanding is that both of them were to right, or right center. Now, is that Jones being smart (and skilled)? Or is that luck and small samples? What did his scatter look like with the Rainiers (is that data available for MiLB?) I don’t think it matters much which way you hit the ball in Jacobs Field, but obviously in Safeco if you can tailor your swing to hit to right you’re going to have much more success with slugging.
do you think anyone tells Neihaus to do anything?
Oh my God — Dave: How many seams on a baseball?
I have a question, who do you think will have a brighter future, Wladimir Balentien or Adam Jones? My friend thinks Wlad will and Jones will just be mediorce, but i disagree and think Jones will be better?
On the other hand, the leave-him-alone-and-don’t-worry-about-him approach hasn’t really worked with Edwin Jackson. If you guys are running the club, do you see something in Jackson worth trying to salvage at this point?
I wonder if opposing hitters look at their upcoming schedule and say “yay, we’re playing the Mariners next and can pad our stats a little bit.”
Who foresaw Brendan Harris as a worthy reclamation project? I honestly thought he was a Bloomquist at best.
Now that the M’s are out of the race, I have no problems with seeing Weaver get pummeled, thereby decreasing the chances that the M’s re-sign him.
Greg Norton = Tampa’s Nick Punto. If that.
I can hear the postgame comments by McLaren already, “He really didn’t pitch bad, just a ground ball here and there that got through. He’s no Horacio Ramirez, but as terms of athletic ability, Weaver is 100x better than Adam Jones.”
I’m sure the Ms announcers have been told to pretend the team is still in the pennant race.
Did you listen to the “John MacLaren Show” pre-game? Dave N asked, and I think this is an exact quote: “At this point are you going to accept the inevitable and play the kids more?”
I just about drove off the road, jaw agape. I couldn’t believe he said that. MacLaren came back with the old “We’re not out of it yet and I think you have to play the guys that brought you to where you are — they earned it. We’re working with the kids, we work with them every day, and they’re getting acclimated to the whole major league life, and I think there’s some value to that…” and blah blah blah.
Dave came back and apologized for using the word “inevitable” — I expect he was getting some furious looks from other people in the studio. But he definitely used it. And he definitely was asking hopefully if we would see more of the rookies.
So essentially, everybody knows the season is over but they can’t admit it lest there be some deluded soul left at Safeco who will only stop coming when they actually come out and say they have no chance. I don’t think that person exists, personally, and I think they might attract a little more interest at this point by playing the kids and talking up their stories. If nothing else it would give the announcers some new material to cover when the bullpen is giving up grand slams and the game is long past being in doubt. But hey, I’m not in sports marketing.
I would expect nothing less from Weaver.
do I have to post the Official Mariner Cartoon again???
Maybe he can underhand it in for a strike.
#62 Naw, they say they can pad their stats a lot!
Willie tells Weaver “Throw a strike or I’ll grit you.”
67 – But during the game Dave N went right back to mouthing the company line and backing up JMac as the managerial genius he is.
WFB with wise words of wisdom for Weaver. . .
I love Blowers’ defense of MacLaren, too, when he said “blah blah blah gotta go with the guys who are grinding it out…”
Dude, they suck. They’ve been dropping games left and right. They’re not grinding anything out.
I’m starting to think we should just start relievers instead of the starters. Ramirez at least got 5 outs, right? Or was it 4 as well?
Well, no Jones.
Like I mentioned before, I don’t think Jones is any great shakes. I think Mike Cameron is his potential. Cameron was a fine player, but he’s wasn’t a perennial all-star. And like Cameron, I think that Jones will probably find modest success with some other ballclub.
But even given that assessment, we’re essentially giving his playing time to Willie Bloomquist. Now, Willie Bloomquist isn’t nearly as good as Jones, and nor is he “hot”. The difference between his and Vidro’s defense (or sitting Vidro, resting him up for next year or some other excuse) isn’t as important as Jones getting his shot to play a full week or two worth of baseball.
I must say, Mothership Wit is an excellent Witbier. Thank you, New Belgium!
They’re grinding something out but it’s not pretty.
Turd sausage, maybe?
what’s Boras going to put in Jeff Weaver’s off-season Sales Portfolio?
Wow, Jeff, way to improve your free agent value.
“I think they might attract a little more interest at this point by playing the kids and talking up their stories. If nothing else it would give the announcers some new material to cover when the bullpen is giving up grand slams and the game is long past being in doubt. But hey, I’m not in sports marketing.”
Remember Bucky? Felix? Sometimes the kids get incredible press – as long as you play them.
LOL this has got to be the season low point.
I don’t recall a worse display of pitching abilities.
Delmon really pisses me off sometimes. Soooooo godamn aggressive. Take a pitch, son.
There we go, we were just walking the players that weren’t a good matchup. We wanted that double play ball and were going to keep walking guys until we found the right guy to hit it.
Weavers Line:
1.1 IP
5 ER
6 H
2 BB
1 K
sadly, I don’t think ‘play the ones who brung ya’ is the company line– you hear the same think out of former players who don’t have an affiliation with the team
If you think Mike Cameron is Adam Jones’ absolute upside, then no one should really care what you think.
w/r/t Jones — even if Jones has Cameron’s career, we should be overjoyed. That’d be great to have that kind of defense with Cameron’s peak offense while he’s under team control. That’s exactly the kind of premium young player you can build a core around.
79 – 2006 World Series hero. 2007: struggled with injuries for most of season and was unusually ineffective. Will bounce back great for 2008.
I was kinda hoping for another walk for a walking grand slam.
I’ve wondered why, with the expanded rosters, the team doesn’t try having 3-4 guys go max effort for the Weaver and HoRam starts.
mentioning cartoons reminded me that I hadn’t looked at Choi Hoon’s baseball cartoons this year … and there is this one from when the Ms were still in the race (you know, two weeks ago)
I never know what the darned things say, but you can usually tell what they mean.
And Ibanez, Vidro, Broussard, Sexson, Etc. are better than a young Mike Cameron?
Wow. Just wow.
Go Vets!
Actually, he did get all of that one. Unfortunately all of a ball from Vidro aint much.
Woah!! Vidro actually has power. Didn’t exactly direct that power the right way, but still.
Astounding.
Can someone tell me where the “staff of aces” are on this team?
95- Maybe someone has a pack of playing cards in his back pocket?
Also, just for fun, David Wells has thrown three scoreless innings so far tonight giving him a 3.15 ERA since joining the Dodgers.
Clearly, he has nothing left to offer to a major league team, and when we suggested picking him up, we were showing our ignorance.
We’re on the internet, and thus without insight or credibility.
Will you guys be quiet so we can watch the veteran guys who got us here grind this one out?
No lie … people think “New York Vinnie” is a serious baseball analyst. Because he’s always had a conventional media platform for his blather.
This has quickly degenerated from a “break out the champagne” season to a “stumble down to the corner AM/PM and pick up another half-rack of Pabst Blue Ribbon” season.
#95– here?
Anybody think Elijah Dukes will make it back?
The upside to bringing him back: His kids will inflate Tropicana attendance figures by at least 10 percent.
101… I can never make out his commentary between his swallowing of entire “Alfy’s” pizzas.
well duh, Derek. why, most every morning I am told by the radio that the only safe place to go on the internet for Mariner information is Baker, because he is actually with the team every day.
Tropicana attendance will go up once the Rays put a halfway competitive team on the field. The city of Tampa has good fans, and it’s a terrific baseball area, but when the team isn’t ever worth a damn, it’s hard to get excited over the team.
And Dukes should of been outright released a long time ago. I don’t care what ‘upside’ he has, the kid’s a total head case.
BJ Upton is from my hometown. Go BJ!
Niehaus: “B.J. Upton, also a pretty good shortstop.”
Actually, he was diastrously bad at shortstop – so bad that he hasn’t played an inning there this year. He was probably the worst defensive second baseman in baseball before they finally gave up and stuck him in center field.
BJ Upton looks like he has an entire chewed up hamburger in his mouth.
DAMMIT, MIKE, DON’T ASK DAVE QUESTIONS!
I love the history lesson from Dave.
Upton should of been put in CF a long time ago, he’s a natural out there. It’s also cleared his head offensively and helped him out tremendously at the plate.
That’s Tampa management’s fault that he was stuck in the IF for such a long time. He had terrible footwork and mechanics, and he doesn’t have to worry about such things in the OF.
Abner Doubleday also founded Doubleday books.
I bet they have a hat full of wacky anecdotes that they pull out and force Dave to read so that he wont say crazy sh$t like playing Adam Jones is “inevitable”.
Weaver’s season has been the very definition of bell curve. Or, maybe more like spike curve.
Abner Doubleday also split the atom, invented Wonder Bread and founded the Tour de France.
you know, you combine the end of a season with terrible games and that young pup Mike in the booth, and it becomes going to a baseball game with garrulous Grandpa Dave.
Jorge Velandia, he of the .151 career ML average, is killing you guys. Sorry about that.
#116– more like a spike in the head.
Also, just for fun, David Wells has thrown three scoreless innings so far tonight giving him a 3.15 ERA since joining the Dodgers.
Not that it matters in our evaluation of how he might have helped the Mariners, but he’s also 2-for-2 with a double. I love David Wells.
Oops, missed a tag. My bad.
[Sims]
Did Blowers just say Weaver had it early in the game?
Wow this Weaver guy Blowers speaks of sounds good.
Blowers says he is a veteran too.
Can we re-sign him at say 13 million a year for 3-4 years?
Abner Doubleday also, of course, invented Doublemint Gum.
Abner Doubleday is the godfather of the Double Play Twins.
I think he said one of his pitches was there early in the game.
Hoon’s take on the AL impact & disappointing players– Pena & Sexson are both featured. Dang, I wish I read Korean.
msb, thanks for the correction. I still have trouble with the concept of “early in the game” in this situation.
Vets: “I thought we were going to see Matlock!”
#129– hey, how much earlier can you get than the 1st inning?
well, apparently the Ms were doomed this year–
any one know anyone who reads Korean?
Yeah, I wish we had preview boxes…
Delmon is such a hacker.
131 – Cant help you, but it looks like Bavasi really ticked off Super Mario.
And Sean White is shutting us down. I know the lineup tonight blows and all, but c’mon.
I didn’t know the Devil Rays had fans.
The Rays have lots of fans.
I know that BA is NOT a good indicator of whether a player is a good hitter or not …
but just for fun, the Mariners ENTIRE line-up tonight does not sport one person batting under .280 for the season.
And yet they’re being shut out by a guy with a 6.75 ERA
Do the Rays have more fans than I have fingers?
D’oh!
I’m a Rays fan when they play the Yankees.
I don’t know, Georgia, I’d of asked the same of Mariners fans before 1995.
How about those Bucaneers? How have they been doing lately?
They stink, but then again, this isn’t about the Bucs. It’s about people unfairly criticizing Rays fans for not supporting a franchise that’s never given them a reason to cheer for them.
As a native of Seattle, and a former M’s fan myself, I can safely say that the Trop is a lot like the Kingdome was before the M’s started winning.
Sims just said that Willie has his 39th start of the season in this game….so how many has Adam Jones had this year? McLaren is an idiot.
Are the other young guys brought up in the September call up here so they can get a good seat in the dugout to watch the game or will McLaren actually play them at some point this month?
I’d really like to know what this one is about.
I have never criticized Rays fans. I didn’t know there were any.
And why would you abandon the M’s? I live in NYC but would never
be caught dead rooting for the teams out here.
I see that at the start of the year, Hoon thought the Angels would take the West, and also that some organizations produce pitchers. I like the drawing of Jamie…
I left Seattle in 1984 and I haven’t lived there for years. Over time, I drifted away from them, not because I didn’t like watching them anymore, but because the Bay Area was so far away from Seattle, and it was hard to keep up with teams back then that were located across the country.
I guess as a Rays fan, I see a lot of what the M’s used to be like.
#146– damfino, but apparently the Ms have no superheroes.
BTW, nice sarcasm with the ‘I didn’t know they had fans’ comment. It is what it is.
Did anyone else catch Neihaus going on and on about Abner Doubleday? He got it right how Doubleday didn’t invent baseball, but then turns around and mentions almost off-handedly that Doubleday WAS in command at Ft. Sumter in Charleston Habor when the Civil War started.
I’ll bet that would have been news to Major Robert Anderson, the US Army officer who was *actually* in command of Ft. Sumter when the South Carolina militia opened fire on the fort.
*sigh*
Lord, the Rays are wasting opportunities in this game.
The thing about Betancourts… they bounce!
this would be a fun game if they weren’t 5 in the hole by the end of the 2nd.
never mind.
Abner Doubleday also invented German chocolate cake.
153 – Aren’t there any Rays blogs out there with game threads?
Sure are, thus why I’m posting at both USSM and raysbb.com.
FWIW, I’m not trying to start an argument here. I just get tired of all the ‘the Rays don’t have any fans’ posts.
mmm. cake.
Few know that Abner Doubleday also defeated Alexander the Great, wrote Beethoven’s 9th Symphony and in his senile final days, claimed to be a devotee of a great new force to come, the “Saytanne Raies Near Forte Lauderdayle”.
there you go. out of [Sims]‘ mouth: “the Mariners are still mathematically in it, but you have to be the greatest optimist to think … “
“Li’l Abner” Doubleday was quite the man.
The Rays have fans. But knowing that you never have a chance for playoffs must suck…
This has quickly degenerated from a “break out the champagne†season to a “stumble down to the corner AM/PM and pick up another half-rack of Pabst Blue Ribbon†season.
We’re waaaaay past that. It’s Thunderbird time (perhaps the City of Seattle saw this coming when they banned the sale of “fortified” libations in the area near Safeco). It’s unfortunate the Big Time Brewery discontinued their “Ave Rat” malt liquor right before the M’s went into their death spiral.
2007 – Attendance — Tampa Bay, 30 of 30
30 Tampa Bay 75 1,221,640 16,288
The Rays have more prospects than the M’s ever did through most of the Kingdome days. With decent ownership (which they might now have), a better home stadium, and some smart marketing, they could go far. Alas, they’re in the AL East.
#166: give it up. There’s few (if any) markets who would draw at all with the success Tampa has had and their stadium. It’s apples and oranges, dude.
And the Mariners before 1995 had a lot of years when they were last or second to last in attendance. Again, you expect fans to show up when the franchise have never given you any hope?
And I don’t buy the argument that the Rays can’t compete in the AL East. The Sox and Yankees will have down years, and sooner than you think.
apparently, Ladies Love the Brewers
God awful night by Delmon. He’s just up there hacking at anything.
Again with the Mac defense. We get it, we get it.
The thing about that particular defense, which talked about how we will get to see the kids (when? when if not now?) is that they went on and on about Broussard… who is playing because Sexson can’t.
As if playing Broussard somehow makes up… ARRGGHH
Those Hoon toons are great. I could print them out and run across the street to ask the guy in the convenience store to translate them (Seriously. There’s a convenience store across the street and the family that runs it is Korean. I think I’ve even heard the M’s game on the radio when I’ve been in there).
But maybe it would be more fun to go all MST3K on them and make up our own English translations?
152, 161 you gonna lets the facts get in the way of a good story.
Don’t get mad at the numbers!
If the Rays have the least fans, they have the least fans.
I’m just pointing out they are a rare and exotic species.
Wow Blowers is showing more passion about Ben Broussard playing over any young guy than anything else all game. He sounded morose and comatose until he just started yelling about that.
Dave, has Delmon’s season discouraged you about his future at all? I know you loved him down in the minors, but he’s had kind of a ‘meh’ rookie season. He’s got a lot of hits, but has a pretty empty average, and he hacks at everything. His arm in the OF has been a weapon, but I knew you were a fan of his, so I wanted to get what you thought of him.
WRT the Mac defense, in general when you hear people being that defensive over something it’s because they know they’re defending the indefensible and try to make up for it by repeating the same argument over and over and over
The funny thing is that the example Blowers used with him and Chavez supports playing the youngsters, not benching them.
The Rays have more fans than you think, they just disguise themselves in Yankees and Sox gear. Lots of front runners in the Tampa area.
We’ll just drop it and move on. It’s not a huge deal, and I’m overreacting about it.
Gee I wonder what it would be like to lose four games in a row to the worst team in baseball. At this point a losing season (80-82? 79-83? 76-86?) is a distinct possibility. So much for Veteran Experience. I’m guessing Bumblevasi keeps his job, but McLosin’ is gone.
ah. and Manny
I bet they have a hat full of wacky anecdotes that they pull out and force Dave to read so that he wont say crazy sh$t like playing Adam Jones is “inevitableâ€.
Note: Dave did not say playing Adam Jones was “inevitable†— the way he posed the question, he was saying that missing the postseason was “inevitable†and, given that, he asked if we would see the kids play. And MacLaren basically answered that until the M’s are mathematically eliminated, he would play the veterans. So really, at this point, you almost want the M’s to lose and the Yankees to win just so we can get this over with asap and see some new and interesting faces. I wonder if MacLaren realizes that’s where his “strategy” is leading us?
even the ‘worst team in baseball’ can play well, and the Rays came in with a better recent record than the Ms. I think everyone has a better record than the Ms of late.
Hold the presses, Blowers “thinks we’re going to see some changes in the rotation”.
No, really?
#182– which is what Blowers was saying, too, that until they are officially out, you can’t ask the vets to step aside (and that the vets shouldn’t want to step aside)
do two Aussies outweigh two Kitsapians?
Rule book double, not ground rule. Sigh.
Here’s the thing: I know that the broadcast crew’s job is to promote the team. I get it. And I might argue that there are better ways to do it, but whatever. The rare moments where they challenge the team that show any kind of independent thought are to be treasured.
But it doesn’t have to be sooooo ridiculous. It’s fine to gloss this over. But don’t insult us.
That’s my boy!
You know what’s funny? I feel like they’re talking to this blog
Thank Whoever for the existence of Ichiro, who almost singlehandedly keeps me interested in the death throes.
That’s what happens when you walk the awfulness that is Willie Blumquist. After two straight nights of big leads being blown, I don’t need anymore of this.
If the broadcast crew is talking to this blog, they’re being absurdly condescending. They talk as if there audience were 8 year olds who have paid no attention to the Mariners over the last couple years.
well, that was not good.
I know Ichiro doesn’t get two hits every game, it just seems like it. And he does have those cold Aprils. But sheesh, once the guy gets going it’s seriously ridiculous. Facing a guy with league-leading ERA? Two hits. Crazy rookies he’s never seen before? Two hits. Aussie reliever, killer closer, any reliever at all? Two hits.
It really makes me stand up and cheer to see the Mariners come back from six down against the worst team in baseball, and now we’re only down by four!! And… double play.
Interesting off-season?
for whom? Except for the A-Rod paper-chase, I don’t even sniff any nice trades going down. It’s going to take major creativity and chutzpah to make the ’08 Mariners look any different from the ’07 Mariners. Even with the mediocrity of the available FA pitchers – they’re decisive upgrades over Weaver and Ramirez, likely upgrades over Batista (who is at least serviceable) and perhaps a marginal upgrade over Washburn (who is at least left-handed and serviceable).
That was a big DP. Balfour has been awful lately after looking pretty damn good since the Rays acquired him.
It must be Star Wars Appreciation Night. There’s a wookie with an I (heart) Beltre sign in attendance.
198: Red! I haven’t even noticed him yet tonight…
#195, According to the ESPN.com preview the Ms had a 52% chance of winning; which, considering they’re playing at home against the Devil Rays, is pretty pathetic. Of course, it also said Richie had a 21% chance of hitting a home run and I’m pretty sure he won’t be playing at all the next 9 games or so.
What would make the offseason interesting is to get Weaver to bulk up and pull an Ankiel — transform him into a power-hitting DH!
did Simms say that Red had brought the Beltre Bobblehead again?
That “Manny Being Manny” cartoon is fantasic. It even references “The Greatest Play of All Time. But I really, seriously want to know what is being said in the panel where it appears Ortiz is talking to Manny while Manny is sitting on the toilet with a roll of toilet paper.
I liked the drawing of Weaver in the #131 cartoon.
you know, if you pretend Weaver isn’t in the rotation, then we are watching a 3-2 game with some cool defense and more Ichiro! hits …
msb – Now you’ve got it. You’re thinkin’ like a Mariner manager!
#205 You know, if you pretend that Weaver and Ramirez aren’t in the rotation, and McLaren isn’t the manager, then we’re leading the Wild Card race!
Who does the Tampa pitcher think he is — Brandon Morrow?
Do I hear a little Kashmir playing at the stadium?
And clearly, the Rays are intent on blowing a third straight game in which they had a comfortable lead.
ah, Seattle. Home of Bad Dancing.
killa, the Mariners have not been up to the task of receiving gifts from anyone lately. If I were you, I wouldn’t sweat it.
I love Sims’ popular culture references. Time seems to have stopped for him in the 1970s.
Sure the Rays have fans. There’s that guy that shouts weird stuff all the time that we can hear on Mariners road games there. Of course, you can hear him easily because of the echo and general lack of competitive noise.
And I have one word that could dramatically improve Tropicana – I-M-P-L-O-S-I-O-N
Mister DP…
speaking of shouting, what is with the sudden loud voice yelling next to the booth this inning? he was exhorting Ben to hit a home run when the inning started…
As only a veteran could do!
Is it wrong that as of today I’m rooting with the mariners to lose because I want to make sure Bavasi and Maclaren are canned?
And how is Horacio still starting. I’m sure someone in the minors or RR-S would be just as good and most likely better… where is the hope for the future?
Loud voice was yelling at Ben to hit a grad slam. With only 2 men on base, that would have been impressive.
Is it just me or is Kenji hitting the ball oppo field more?
when did Jeremy Reed become the pinch hitter of choice?
218: Yes it is wrong.
221 – When Adam Jones started hitting and therefore cant possibly merit playing time.
#221, I don’t know but it appears that he’s attained semi-veteran status in McLaren’s book.
There’s no better time to suck than the present, apparently.
Well it may be wrong, but as far as the future of the franchise, how can we accept management and leadership of this variety?
“You take the win”
“No, I don’t want it, you take it!”
“What would I do with a win? You need it more than I do”
“Well, maybe so, but that’s no reason for me to take it away from you”
“No, seriously….”
ok, JoseL, pay attention!
218 – I still haven’t seen anything to convince me that one result leads to the other.
YUUUUUUUUuuuuuuuuuuni!
Here, take these U’s that Raul’s not using!
Wow, that was impressive. I thought Reed was going to be out for sure.
Yuni strikes again.
226: I didn’t say it wasn’t understandable…go Yuni!
Wow good job Betan-clutch!! or whatever the nickname was?
I wa wondering why Jimerson or Jones was not the pinch runner of choice, but no matter.
And that hit, with the one last night, probably helps Yuni win… a gold glove. Isn’t that how it works?
Why is Yuni still batting #9? I haven’t understood that for some time.
236, yep, that’s why A-Rod will steal it from Beltre at 3B.
Wow.
There’s Red!
Man, check out the crazy Fangraph. TB is coug’ing it.
sorry killa3312. you knew of which you spoke.
236 – Could Jeter possibly still win it? That would be so ridiculous it might be worth it.
Well, to be fair, A-Rod is doing his job and half of Jeter’s too. Beltre has it easy by comparison. Even if he could out-throw ARod while falling backwards into the dugout.
Is Dan Wheeler the Devil Ray version of Rick White?
I honestly dont believe this. I know it’s too late, but still. Wow!
A-Rod’s got it nailed this year I’m afraid.
#243– oh, of course he could. after all, the GG voters gave it to Palmiero when he was a DH.
This bullpen is freakin’ awful.
8-1 lead… gone
4-0 lead… gone
7-1 lead… gone
All in consecutive nights.
Cue the AC-DC.
So THAT’S what a sucky bullpen looks like.
Queue?
Why is Yuni still batting #9? I haven’t understood that for some time.
There’s an argument for having speed on the basepaths ahead of Ichiro (you can’t bat him behind Ichiro because he hacks too much). And 9th doesn’t necessarily mean “worst” — some NL teams actually have had the pitcher bat 8th, to put a Betancourt-like hitter in the 9 slot for the same reason.
Cue.
You knew when that ball took that ridiculous hop on Harris, something like this would happen. I hate this team sometimes. The bullpen holds them back so much.
131 – Any chance anyone knows what that comics says with Weaver. I am really curious to know, even though I am sure its parodying his Weaverly performances.
Cue was right. Unless you were stacking it up behind other tracks on your iPod.
Putz on two nights back to back. This must feel strange for him. Like some kind of happy memory from long, long ago.
Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
Pathetic… good night all.
aaaand, the DoublePlay Twins ad
Meaningless or not it’s still good to see them win.
I dare say, if we win 16 of our next 17 we may have a shot. Umm, yeah, not happening. After tonight’s win you can rest assured that you won’t see Adam Jones get more than 3 ABs for the rest of the year.
nice to hear RRS on the radio, but dang I still miss Snelly.
Krueger is suggesting that RRS pitch instead of Weaver next time.
Sounds like a good idea to me.
Well, he can certainly go as many innings as the M’s starters have been managing lately. And if he can’t give a quality start, there’s always RRS in the bullpen to eat up innnings…. oh, wait.
Every time I see HoRam start I wonder how bad of a pitcher Willie Bloomquist could be. Weaver made me think that tonight too.
Given how many game-winning hits Yuni’s had in the 9th hole, I’m not sure I’d argue with it. Would he really have any more elsewhere?
Ichiro has earned a chance to start a game on the mound for this team.
batting higher than 9th = more at bats
more at bats = more chances of a game winning hit
Why would you think otherwise?
per JJ, not realizing it was RRS’s first win, he gave away the game-winning baseball and so had to get the ball back from the kid (trading him another ball, and a Beltre-donated bat), then he missed his chance to pie Ryan during his radio interview, and so (alerted by EOF) was forced to race out in his skivvies to catch RRS during the FSN stand-up. It’s a hard job being the closer.
Anyone recall that song “Never Surrender” that was in some Van Damme movie back in the late 80s or early 90s? That song should be played at the end of every M’s home game, even after they’ve been mathematically eliminated.
I would think “The Final Countdown” would be more appropriate for this squad.
269: I see your point, but I guess my answer is because nothing about Yuni’s stats indicate that he’d be good in a high-rbi slot (which is where you’d otherwise want you’re game-winning RBI guys to be), and he’s been great in the ninth hole so why change it. But I do see your point, and now that I think about it, I could see Yuni batting a couple slots up. Or even 2nd if he’d stop popping up so much.
By the way, I haven’t read the thread much tonight except for the later posts, and I only saw a few innings of the game, but what do folks think about tonihgt’s lineup? Aside from Willie, and aside from the fact that Jones should have started, and aside from Yuni batting ninth, and aside from the fact that the lineup sucked through much of the game, I liked it. I like sliding Vidro down to six and Beltre at two.
Ichiro and Beltre are the only two M’s regulars I truly enjoy watching hit these days. But now I’m also excited about catching glimpses of Jones, Clement, Balentin, etc.
“I would think ‘The Final Countdown’ would be more appropriate for this squad.”
I would think the Benny Hill theme would be more appropriate at this point (tonight aside).
I just thought “Never Surrender” would be a nice bit o’ sarcasm that some fans would appreciate. Though Beck’s “Loser” might be more appropriate.
131 – Nevermind, i translated it on my own…
sorry let me try that again
[IMG]http://i185.photobucket.com/albums/x188/thefin190/Weaverly.jpg[/IMG]
Ok just one more time, sorry.
Ok, sorry for wasting comment space, but clearly it seems i can’t post images directly here, sorry guys.
here is a link, worked on it for like an hour and a half, hope you like it
http://i185.photobucket.com/albums/x188/thefin190/Weaverly.jpg
You know… Jones had a 3-3 record with a 2.71 ERA as a pitcher in his senior season at high school.
Though Beck’s “Loser†might be more appropriate.
Tom Petty: “Free Falling”
Nine Inch Nails: “The Downward Spiral”
Dreamgirls Soundtrack: “It’s All Over”
And for the fans… Joan Jett: “I Hate Myself (for Loving You)”
From the stands, RRS looked really, really good tonight, though it was probably the Rays hacking lineup combined with watching Weave and White before him. Regardless, he threw 94 at times and struck out 5 in just 2.1. Might he be a good starter someday?
#162 msb said “out of [Sims]’ mouth: ‘the Mariners are still mathematically in it, but you have to be the greatest optimist to think …’ “
The “magic number” (elimination number) for the M’s is 9 for the division title, and 12 for the wild card. 17 games to go, 4 head to head with LAA, 10 in Safeco, all on the West Coast.
It’d be nice to see more results from the NYYs like last night, with Toronto basically doing the same thing the M’s did. For the WC, Detroit is 3.5 games back, the M’s 5.5 games back.
Go Red Sox!!
[six errors]