Silva-Bradley Swap Near?
Larry Stone reports that the M’s may announce a Carlos Silva-Milton Bradley trade as soon as today. This deal has been talked about for a while, because of the matching salaries and the M’s need for a hitter, but the organization had made it clear to a bunch of people that they had no interest in Bradley. That makes this a pretty big surprise, honestly.
If it goes through, there are basically two reactions that we have to reconcile.
1. Milton Bradley is a significantly better player than Carlos Silva, and a much more obvious fit for what this team needs. In terms of production, the M’s just got a lot better. A switch-hitting, high OBP LF/DH is exactly the kind of player that this roster is calling for. And the price is obviously right.
2. Milton Bradley is the exact opposite of the kind of person the organization has spent the last year bringing in. He’s as far removed from Mike Sweeney as you can get. But, the Mariners never promised to have 25 choir boys on the team, and perhaps they feel that the culture that they’ve already created will allow Bradley to have another lower-maintenance season, like he did in 2008. Remember, Wak is good friends with Ron Washington, who was able to get a good full season out of Bradley in 2008.
From the how-will-he-fit-into-the-clubhouse angle, I think we all just really have to defer to Wak on this one. If he thinks he can get through to Bradley and keep him from causing significant problems, then I’m not going to say that he can’t. Very few managers have been able to, but Wak is a very impressive leader of people.
Remember, we’re not just talking about a guy whose a little prickly here. This is a dude who wore a t-shirt saying “F*** Eric Wedge” in the clubhouse when played for the Indians. He’s worn out his welcome everywhere he has been for a reason. This isn’t the kind of “clubhouse chemistry” argument where there’s little evidence that the off-field stuff matters. With Bradley, it matters a lot. He’s a constant threat of getting ejected in any given game, and a suspension is always possible. He fights with umpires, fans, teammates, coaches… odds are decent that he’s going to be offended by the Mariner Moose at some point. It affects his ability to stay on the field and produce, so this is not a small personality flaw that can be dismissed as unimportant.
But the M’s are apparently willing to take that risk. Given that Silva’s money was essentially a sunk cost, they can hold the power to just release Bradley outright without coming out of this deal looking like they got hosed. Perhaps that kind of leverage gives them confidence that they can take a chance on the guy.
If they’re right, the M’s just added a couple more wins to their roster. From a talent perspective, Bradley is perfect for the M’s. This all hinges on how well he and Wak can get along.
Comments
60 Responses to “Silva-Bradley Swap Near?”
I’d be totally ok with this. I know MB has a reputation for being a clubhouse cancer, but so did Jose Guillen, and he was (almost) a model teammate when he was here in ‘07. I think with the right environment, and a lot of wins, I’d far rather have MB than the waste of space and a roster spot that is Silva.
Plus, isn’t it just trading one “clubhouse cancer” for another – only the one we’d get would actually have some ability to contribute to the team?
Straight up? Are the Cubs that desperate to dump Bradley?
This would really put the “In Jack we Trust” mantra to the test.
If this goes down I would not be at all surprised to see Bradley go somewhere else. Mainly because I would not be at all surprised with anything this FO does at this point.
Silva for Bradley rumors.
Morrow for something rumors.
On the same day.
Crash of USS Mariner server in 3.2.1…..
Seriously, you guys – including the fans who post here – have made this the best MLB fan site in the country.
If you need another fund drive to upgrade then just ask.
Even if the M’s just turned around and released Bradley outright, they’d still save ~$3mil over the next two years, correct?
well if this is heads up, and the M’s were about to cut Silva, this saves them $3M. I don’t see Bradley playing here next year, although i do like the thought of him as LF/DH from a on paper perspective. I in no way see Bradley as a guy GMZ wanted, I’m seeing a straight up salary dump in the works. Maybe we will trade for Burrell from the Rays, then just cut Burrell and save 12 million.
Possible benefits:
1. I believe Dave wrote a piece on Bradley a couple months ago asserting that he was unfairly blamed for the Cubs offensive woes, and was likely to positively regressto the mean (and the projecttions on Fangraphs agree).
2. He´s versatile defensively.
3. He´s a switch hitter.
4. In addition to the simple pleasure of dumping Silva´s contract, isn´t it possible that this increases the chances of an 11-man pitching staff?
I have a lot of faith in Wak being able to get Bradley to row in the same direction as everyone else.
Although I do hope he fights the Moose.
Silva for anyone = WIN. Just make sure he passes his physical.
I love Jack Zduriencik. And I love the organization for bringing him here.
This is awesome. Bradley probably DHs quite a bit and plays 20-30 games in LF.
Did Wakamatsu ever coach him in Texas or Oakland?
Any chance the strategy is:
1) Trade for Bradley
2) Wait for him to do something outrageously bad
3) Cut him, and be able to say they tried to the fan base
I doubt the average Safeco denizen understands sunk costs (so just cutting Silva and eating his contract would look bad), but they do understand not wanting bad people on Saint Griffey’s team.
Also the tiny chance that Wak/Griffey can get through to Bradley enough to keep him from burning down the clubhouse around him, which would give them some sort of return for their money beside mop up innings and empty buffet tables.
Not overly excited about it, but there may be a solver lining. And if Jack Z. finds a way to dump Bradley on San Diego in a big package for Gonzalez? =)
I don’t believe that Wak and Bradley have had their respective tenures with Oakland and Texas overlap. Wak was the A’s bench coach in 08 when Bradley was in Texas.
That said, Wak has given every indication in his short managerial career that he has the skills and right frame of mind to work with the Volcanic One.
Man, every day in December is Christmas if you’re a Mariners fan. I love this deal. We transform Carlos Silva into a potentially very useful (if maybe insane) asset.
As long as Bradley doesn’t stab anyone, I don’t think there’s anyway he could end up worse for this team than Silva.
Jack Z could announce that the Mariner Moose is starting at 1B, and I’d give him the benefit of the doubt at this point.
There is nothing that Bradley can do that will burn down the clubhouse, unless of course he complains that some teammates are more concerned about getting their two hits than winning. Oh, wait, the M’s traded that guy away.
Most of Bradley’s problems are not with his teammates. He has problems with the media, fans, and others. Now, this makes it hard on teammates who are constantly asked about him and his statements about the fans and the organization, but I don’t recall any Bradley issues that directly involved other teammates.
Maybe every time he gets out of line he’ll just get tickled by Junior.
I’m tired of spelling out Zduriencik, how about Jack Midas?
Never thought we’d get rid of Silva…. is there anything Jack Z can’t do?
I’m looking to buy a house soon, do you think Jack Z does real estate?
Could this trade, in conjuction with the signing of Langerhans, be a prelude to including Saunders in a deal for Gonzalez?
I’da pooh-poohed this before this month, but now…anything could happen.
Now Langerhans makes more sense. Bradley and Griffey will split time at DH. Bradley, Langerhans and Hall will split time in left field. Micheal Saunders will get the five hundred plate appearances in AAA that he still needs. This is a great move. Now all that is left is solving first base and possibly a risk/reward starter like Bedard, Randy Johnson or Washburn.
Never thought we’d get rid of Silva, is there anything Jack Z can’t do?
Specifically, I’m in the market to buy a house and wondering if Jack Z does real estate.
Agreed…similarly with Carl “I don’t beleive in dinosaurs” Everett. Plus, I think in a clubhouse where Griffey wants to maintain a happy Ichiro and everyone else for that matter, he;ll shape up quick, or as you say in the sunk-cost portion Dave, ship out.
Factoid:
In Baseball-reference’s list of similar batters to MB through age 31, 3 of the top 4 are former Mariners.
Ivan Calderon, Al Martin, and Carl Everett.
Not exactly a list that inspires confidence.
Like the Cubs didn’t fully explore the trade market for Bradley before they settled on Carlos Silva for the best they could get. And even with the market as bad as it is for Bradley, I wouldn’t be surprised if we weren’t shipping some cash the the Cubs as part of the deal. If we ship Bradley out afterword we’ll likely have to ship more cash out. I just can’t see it happening. Stone notes that Bradley has 21m remaining and Silva 25m, and speculates the Cubs!?!?! will ship cash to the M’s to make up the difference? Huh?
Also worth noting is that Wakamatsu was a coach at both the Rangers and A’s, and while he evidently was not there at the same time Bradley was, I’m sure he will be able to get a candid opinion from some people he trusts at both of those organizations. He was bench coach of the A’s in 2008, Bradley left the A’s in the middle of the previous season.
What I love about this move is that it takes nothing away from the $12-$15 allotted for our holes at 1B & DH. We’re still sitting on a whole bunch of cash and now only have one major hole to fill (1B). Say we bring back Branyan at ~$5m, does this move allow us to enter the Chapman sweepstakes? Or possibly allow us to take a chance on bringing Bedard back? Either way, this move is awesome.
What I love about this move is that it takes nothing away from the $12-$15 allotted for our holes at 1B & DH. We’re still sitting on a whole bunch of cash and now only have one major hole to fill (1B). Say we bring back Branyan at ~$5m, does this move allow us to enter the Chapman sweepstakes? Or possibly allow us to take a chance on bringing Bedard back? Either way, this move is awesome.
I think this is a GREAT deal!
If he is right mentally and physically, then we just picked up a middle of the order switch-hitter for a waste of a roster space in Silva.
If Bradley goes looney the M’s can release him and are no worse off than they are now. But if Bradley is right, this is a potentially huge move.
If Bradley can’t hack it in Seattle with this clubhouse, city and fans, he can’t make it in baseball period, in my opinion. Hopefully a guy like Griffey and the other good guys they have can keep Bradley in line.
Hey, even the best of us have said “F*** Dave Sampson” every now and then.
Seattle seems like about the best fit possible for a guy like Bradley.
- Low-key media.
- Low-key fans.
- No salary pressure, since he didn’t sign here.
- Great clubhouse, including level-headed manager, designated tickler, no contrary personalities.
- Team with potential but probably not unrealistic expectations of success.
I think Langerhans was signed to be our 5th outfielder stashed in Tacoma. That allows us to have Bradley and Hall split the 4th outfielder duties and give us some more flexibility on the bench. Then if someone goes down for a few weeks we have somebody to we can just plug in at any of the three OF spots and not pay a significant penalty defensively.
Aside from the awesomeness of adding a switch hitting high OBP guy, what I love about this move is that it takes nothing away from the $12-$15 allotted for our holes at 1B & DH. We’re still sitting on a whole bunch of cash and now only have one major hole to fill (1B). Say we bring back Branyan at ~$5m, this move allows us to be very serious in the Chapman sweepstakes… Or possibly allow us to take a chance on bringing in another high-risk/reward pitcher (Sheets? Bedard?) in the neighborhood of $7m. Rosterbating about the other fruits this trade leads us to makes it even more awesome.
I am still in shock…
This is unbelievable~ I thought we were stuck with Silva for ever! Bradley is a project, but what a clubhouse for him… Wak will keep things on an even keel.
I mean I was already loving Z but WOW!! I MEAN WOW WOW WOW!!!
Okay, seriously now…
Did Jack really just pull off another deal that cost us virtually nothing (or in this case less than)? I echo the real estate mention earlier. I have 200k to spend on a house, can Jack get one for me by trading my old water heater and fridge?
This guy is plugging holes left and right and not spending any money!! That yellow sun of Earth must grant him extra power beyond human capabilities or something…
Like the move very much. If Bradley doesn’t work out, we can cut him. But Milton presents a real possibility to produce for this team while Silva didn’t.
And “Carlos Silva” is a trending topic on Twitter. Incredible.
Financially I get it,
Roster construction and salary management, I get it,
Adding a bat, I get it.
Emotionally .. I don’t want this career baseball felon anywhere near my team, not now, not ever.
I do not want to have to THINK about “Milton Bradley” in any context other than “somebody else’s problem.”
I do not care how much value upside he could bring the M’s. He’s a drag to be around, he’s an awful human being, he is quite simply not fit to wear a professional baseball players’ uniform. He stands for everything the M’s try to be against.
Very sorry if they go through with this. I don’t care if he pretends to be a choir boy the whole season, that just means he’ll set everyone up to depend on him later, at which point he will implode, like he always implodes.
Might want to check that “full time” 2008 season. 416 plate appearances? Really?
And thats his upside.
No Thanks. Bad fit, at any price. It sickens me after all the good Jack Z has done, he’s willing to put the Mariners anywhere near this mess of a ballplayer. It sends the wrong signal to everyone, undoes the good work of signing Lee and Figgins.
I am not just saying this now, BUT…
I’ve been saying since Buhner left, this team has always been lacking that one Firery player that good teams need.
Yes the clubhouse feeling last year was great and they should continue to have ‘good’ clubhouse guys, but they are/were almost too soft.
Milton Bradley, is he crazy? Yeah. But Ultra Competitive. Plus he’s pretty good too. I love it! (And I didn’t even mention Bad Fat Silva)
I will pay very good money to see Milton Bradley fight the Moose. I think that may well be one of the things I hope for most in the 2010 season should we sign MB.
My money’s on Moose, too. Just ask Coco Crisp. If Moose wants a piece of you, watch out.
Drayer just tweeted this is official.
Seattle seems like about the best fit possible for a guy like Bradley.
- Low-key media.
- Low-key fans.
- No salary pressure, since he didn’t sign here.
- Great clubhouse, including level-headed manager, designated tickler, no contrary personalities.
- Team with potential but probably not unrealistic expectations of success.
Exactly! Couldn’t say it any better.
The fact that the M’s signed Langerhans to a MAJOR LEAGUE deal the day before trading for Bradley tells me something else is brewing…have a feeling Saunders is going to get traded maybe in a bigger deal for a big bat at 1B. Why would the M’s guarantee Langerhans a major league deal essentially the same day as a Bradley deal goes down if they don’t think Langerhans will be on the team?
Mitlon can DH against lefties and Griffey can DH against righties…Milton can play in LF against righties with Hall or Langerhans in LF against lefties and with Langerhans being a good backup at all OF positions.
I think another deal is brewing!
There is a rhythm to this offseason.
Harden anticipation builds; lose out on Harden; trade for Lee.
Nick Johnson anticipation builds; lose out on Johnson; trade for Bradley.
Who is our next target? And which miracle trade will happen after that falls through?
I was wondering about this kind of thing. One reason we won 85 games last year was because after a couple of months we no longer had Silva losing a game and/or destroying our bullpen every five days. Looking at the roster, I was wondering how we would do that in 2010. This is one solution. It still makes think Z isn’t done yet though as we’re starting to get (assuming the deal goes through), a logjam in the outfield.
I cannot believe the unending stream of amazingness. I haven’t been this excited about the team since 2001.
I’m sure it’s been mentioned a few times, but this also makes the Griffey deal look better, since I want to hope that he’ll help mitigate the crazy.
And wins.
Seriously… I think this move is awesome. I honestly thing Bradley will find the support and respect he craves in this clubhouse, and will get along just fine. If he doesn’t, worse case scenario you cut him loose and still save $3mil. Frickin genious.
certaindoom:
So tell us, please, what was it like for you, being in a major league clubhouse with Milton Bradley?
I LOVE thinking about a Silva-free Mariners. This is going to keep my dopey grin on my face for a long time.
I also agree about the benefits of having that “crazy SOB” guy on the team. It has to make the opposing players a little on edge thinking they might get attacked / eaten at any time if they push the wrong buttons.
The thing that I like about this trade (other than the fact that we turned a AAA pitcher making #2 money into a potentially excellent hitter) is what it tells me about our front office. With all of the high character guys we’ve acquired in the past year, you had to wonder whether the front office would be willing to take a chance on a talented but potentially problematic player. We certainly have an excellent clubhouse in place – I would like to think that this trade means that our front office prioritized clubhouse chemistry as a groundwork to future moves. If Griffey can take Bradley under his wing and make him a happy player, then suddenly his resigning gains a few points.
(Plus, winning = chemistry, so just win, boys.)
I wondered about also…except I was thinking since the other name associated with Bradley has been Tampa Bay so maybe Carl Crawford???
Uh, no. Risk involved? Sure. But this move is not a stupid move. Not at all. And it certainly doesn’t “undo” any of the good moves. If anything, it proves Z can snap his fingers and make the impossible reality.
Okay, here’s something I bet you never thought you’d see.
Carlos Silva is a hot topic on Twitter.
I’m guessing M’s are sending cash to the Cubs. From MLB.com:
Still, I love the move. Even if nickwest1976 is wrong, and we stick with Bradley on the roster, I think we’re still in way better shape than with Silva. On the other hand if it leads to something bigger and better then hallelujah.
I was always told it was impossible to get something for nothing.
I’m not so sure anymore.
In its own right, this deal is actually better than Lee, in the sense that our three prospects in that deal had projectable value…and Silva did not.
And while I have no insight into the mind and methods of Milton Bradley, I do have friends who repeated some of the things yelled at him from the bleachers at Wrigley last year. They can’t be repeated here. Beer and stupid is never a good combination, and Bradley can testify to that.
Also, if he creates a problem in the clubhouse here, isn’t that Griffey’s responsibility as well as the manager’s? That’s Griffey’s presumed value now, right?
Finally, in terms of perhaps this ushering in another larger deal, I keep looking at the depth chart for the hated Padres and seeing David Eckstein starting at second. Surely there’s someone they could get better than that!
Kazinski wrote:
“…I wouldn’t be surprised if we weren’t shipping some cash the the Cubs as part of the deal. If we ship Bradley out afterword we’ll likely have to ship more cash out. I just can’t see it happening. Stone notes that Bradley has 21m remaining and Silva 25m, and speculates the Cubs!?!?! will ship cash to the M’s to make up the difference? Huh?”
I’m with Larry on this one. Zduriencik made very clear during the Winter Meetings he wasn’t interested in a deal for Bradley that likely would have been trade cancer-for-cancer and even out salary differences, telling the Cubs to look elsewhere. They did, and there was zero interest. That the Cubs came crawling back to the M’s afterward tells me this deal will be done on the Mariners’ terms, not the Cubs’. Plus, it’s Zduriencik doing the deal….
The Cubs press release has us shipping over $9M to the Cubs in this deal…how will that in turn impact our remaining funds now?
[Piniella]
At this point, are we really even trying to not be completely blindsided by everything this front office does? And not in a bad way. It’s like we’re trying to get across a fast deep river, talking about bridges and pontoons and boats, and Jack Z just strolls across and we’re left saying “Well, ok, but I didn’t know walking on water was even an option.”
I’d love to see MB beat up the Moose*. I’d pay to see MB beat up the Moose. Potentially best YouTube ever.
*The Moose, not the guy inside. Assuming MB sticks to beating on its padded head, the guy inside should escape with nothing bruised beyond his dignity… dignity? He’s the freaking Moose!
This December has been more exciting than a lot of the seasons in the last 9 years. I’m ordering my Zduriencik jersey today.
“According to sources, Piniella then shouted at Bradley, â€You’re not a player! You’re a piece of sh–!â€
Bradley then said, â€I have too much respect for you to respond to that,†a source said.”–Chicago Sun Times.
The best thing about this move (other that getting rid of Carlos Silva), is it completely squashes all those rumors about Jason Bay, and Johnny Damon. I got sick of seeing those ridiculous rumors day after day.
I hadn’t noticed that Langerhans got a major league contract. Assuming Bradly DH’s and Saunders plays LF, that would leave our bench at:
Griffey
Johnson
Hall
Hanahan
Langerhans
Plus 9 regulars (including an unnamed 1st baseman), and 11 pitchers.