Dave’s 2012 Off-Season Plan (Part One)

Dave · November 2, 2011 at 8:49 am · Filed Under Mariners 

So, I’ve been rolling these posts out every winter for about a decade now, but this year, I’m actually doing two of these posts. As you’ve probably gathered from my musings over the last few months, I’m of the opinion that the M’s should target a certain first baseman from the Cincinnati Reds this winter, and make acquiring him priority #1. However, there is the potential reality that the Reds just might not be willing to trade him, even if the Mariners put together an extremely strong offer in order to try to change their minds.

The moves in this post are all predicated upon the fact that the M’s could potentially acquire Joey Votto. The roster below really only works if he’s on it, and the rest of the moves were made with the assumption that he’s now anchoring the team’s offense. If he’s not on it, different moves would have to be made. So, we’re doing two Off-Season Plan plan posts this year – one where Votto can be had and one where he can’t. In this scenario, he can be. We’ll deal with Plan B next week.

On to the moves, many of which I’ve tried to lay the groundwork for in prior posts.


Trade RHP Michael Pineda, RHP Brandon League, OF Greg Halman, 3B Chone Figgins (with Seattle absorbing $16 of remaining $17 million on Figgins’ contract), and SS Carlos Triunfel to Cincinnati for 1B Joey Votto and C Yasmani Grandal.

Trade 1B Mike Carp to Milwaukee for 3B Casey McGehee and RHP Marco Estrada.

Trade OF Michael Saunders and RHP Dan Cortes to Florida for RHP Chris Volstad.

Trade LHP Cesar Jimenez to New York for OF Angel Pagan.

Sign Chris Snyder to a 1 year, $3 million contract.

Sign Erik Bedard to a 1 year, $4 million contract.

Sign Jamie Moyer to a 1 year, $500,000 contract.

The big move is obviously the Votto acquisition. The team pays a high price by surrendering Pineda+ to get him, but when you’re trying ta acquire MVP-caliber talent, you have to put a knockout package on the table. With the pitching staff taking a hit to bring Votto in, many of the other moves are made to replenish the depth lost in the main deal.

Carp is an expendable piece whose strong second half would likely fetch a couple of solid role players in retrun. With Prince Fielder on his way out, the Brewers could use a power hitting left-handed first baseman, and they’re not likely to let Mat Gamel come to spring training without competition for the job. Estrada is an interesting arm who Wedge may should be comfortable giving the closer’s title to out of spring training, but could potentially move into a rotation role if Tom Wilhelmsen proves ready for 9th inning duty at some point during the summer. McGehee gives the team flexibility at third base and a right-handed bat with some power that they’re lacking.

Volstad essentially replaces Pineda in the rotation, as the M’s get another young hurler with problems against LHBs, though the upside is substantially lower. The Marlins would almost certainly part with their frustrating young hurler, and Saunders and Cortes both offer enough tools to sell as change-of-scenery upside buys for Florida.

Pagan is a perfect complement to Casper Wells in left field and offers a legitimate alternative to Franklin Gutierrez if his health continues to be a problem. The M’s can offer Jimenez and his always intriguing K rates from an LHP to the Mets to convince them to tender him a contract rather than putting him out on the free agent market in December.

Finally, the team finishes with three one year contracts to health risk free agents, adding depth and some upside without parting with much cash. Snyder offers a decent approach at the plate and sets up a job-share at catcher. Bedard returns to the friendly confines of Safeco Field to once again try to spend more than half a season on the mound and rebuild some value. Moyer comes back to the place he was most successful to try to sustain his career. For relative peanuts, the team gets three guys who may not be workhorses, but offer intriguing possibilities for when they are on the field and give the team depth at positions of weakness.

That collection of moves, combined with the remaining talent already in the organization, gives us the following team.

The Roster

Position Name PA/IP WAR Salary
C Chris Snyder 300 1 $3,000,000
1B Joey Votto 600 6 $9,500,000
2B Dustin Ackley 600 3 $1,500,000
SS Brendan Ryan 500 1.5 $1,750,000
3B Casey McGehee 500 1.5 $2,500,000
LF Angel Pagan 500 2 $5,000,000
CF Franklin Gutierrez 600 2.5 $5,813,000
RF Ichiro Suzuki 600 2 $18,000,000
DH Justin Smoak 600 2 $450,000
C Miguel Olivo 300 0.5 $3,750,000
IF Luis Rodriguez 200 0.5 $450,000
IF Kyle Seager 350 1 $450,000
OF Casper Wells 300 1 $450,000
SP Felix Hernandez 220 6 $19,200,000
SP Jason Vargas 180 2.5 $4,000,000
SP Chris Volstad 180 2.5 $2,000,000
SP Erik Bedard 120 2 $4,000,000
SP Jamie Moyer 100 0 $500,000
CL Marco Estrada 60 0.5 $450,000
RP Tom Wilhelmsen 60 0.5 $450,000
RP Shawn Kelley 60 0.5 $450,000
RP Charlie Furbush 60 0.5 $450,000
RP Josh Lueke 60 0.5 $450,000
RP Chance Ruffin 60 0 $450,000
RP Blake Beavan 120 0 $450,000
  Chone Figgins 0 0 $8,000,000
Total     40 $93,463,000

By acquiring a lower salaried star in Votto, there was enough money left to fill various holes with useful role players and not have to expand the budget from beyond where it was last year. This roster is essentially do-able for what the team has been spending historically, and while it’s not as good as what Texas will put on the field next year, it’s not that far from being a contender.

The roster projects out right around +40 WAR, which is roughly an 83 win team. However, there’s upside here – Gutierrez, Pagan, and Ichiro were all substantially better than their projected values in the recent past, while Ackley, Smoak, and Volstad all have enough talent to surpass what is expected of them here. Potential second-half additions in Danny Hultzen and James Paxton could bolster the pitching staff, but would only be summoned if they had shown they were ready for the show.

You’d need breaks to go your way, some good luck with guys staying healthy, and perhaps a breakthrough performance from a couple of the relievers to solidify the bullpen, but contending is a possibility for this squad. At the very least, they should be able to play respectable baseball and get fans excited about coming to Safeco Field once again.

The other benefit – the team still retains most of their long term cost flexibility for the 2013 off-season. Unlike locking yourself into a free agent who will eat up a huge part of the budget for the foreseeable future, this roster gives you the ability to make adjustments going forward. It’s a path to putting a good team on the field without requiring an all-in bet on one player. It gives the Mariners the chance to be good without destroying their future if one big ticket acquisition fails to live up to his hefty contract.

For me, this would be Plan A. Go balls to the wall to get Votto, and then do what’s necessary to fill in the pieces around him to make this a respectable team who could potentially contend in 2012 and would be setup well for 2013 and beyond. If the Reds decide not to play ball when discussing their first baseman… well, we’ll get to Plan B later.


184 Responses to “Dave’s 2012 Off-Season Plan (Part One)”

  1. Chris_From_Bothell on November 3rd, 2011 5:25 pm

    I personally feel that a lot of Dave’s annoyance is coming from people making claims in absolute terms like “that won’t work” or “he isn’t worth it”.

    I personally feel a lot of Dave’s annoyance is coming from people not arguing the way he wants to argue. This recurs in discussions with people using some sabrmetric concepts, sometimes. I’ve seen it here and a couple other sites. It can frequently go like this:

    “Here is my premise. It is based on these figures and stats. I have added or subtracted these figures and stats this exact way. The only refutation I will accept is an error in the math, or an argument with different players but presented using these exact stats. If you do not agree with the theory behind these figures and stats, or present any other point, you’re not using FACTS and you’re just wildly speculating and you’re not worth my time because geez, go read up on how these stats are used, would you?”

    I realize people get into this mindset on non-sabrmetric positions too (“everyone knows that scouting tells us”, “everyone knows you don’t do X in this game situation”, “unwritten rule of baseball is”, etc.).

    Dave has used published WAR numbers to come up with his values

    It’s entirely likely I missed this – and please point me to where info on this sort of thing is, if so – but while Dave used published WAR numbers for listing past performance, he used some other method for estimating future value.

    Dave’s guess at future value is just that, a guess. Not some unassailable mathematical certainty. There are formulas for a player’s past and current WAR, but far as I know, no 100% solid way to predict the upcoming season’s value.

    Again, if there’s some formula that says e.g. “average of last 3 seasons’ WAR plus X adjustment for age and Y adjustment for injury equals next season’s WAR”, let me know.

    And it’s fine to estimate and guess – that’s what we all do, and with Dave’s experience writing about this sport his guesses are probably more accurate than many people’s certain facts – but don’t get in a frustrated huff when people treat what is essentially a guess, as being somewhat less than a Biblical proclamation.

  2. JoshJones on November 3rd, 2011 5:30 pm

    I’m not advocating for Prince Fielder BUT based on Daves assesment of WAR wouldn’t prince fielder be a steal of a deal?

    The going rate for a win in free agency is about $5 million per season

    Prince is probablly the closest thing to a guaranteed +5WAR player and should maintain that for at least the next 5 years.

    He’s probablly going to cost LESS than 25$ a season so…..

  3. Chris_From_Bothell on November 3rd, 2011 5:33 pm

    He’s probablly going to cost LESS than 25$ a season so…..

    I thought the ranges being thrown about at one point were like Texiera money, around 200 million over 8 years… which is 25 mil a season.

  4. Chris_From_Bothell on November 3rd, 2011 5:43 pm

    While Votto has put up great numbers in Cincy, he’s NOT a good fit for Safeco. Votto led the league in opposite field homeruns last year

    Good point. But do his homerun locations map to where he gets other types of hits also? I.e. just because the majority of his homeruns are to left-center, does that also mean that how he gets his singles and doubles aren’t a good fit?

    Safeco may turn a bunch of his homeruns into long outs or sac flies, but if he can still be a productive singles/doubles hitter at home and a homerun threat on the road (esp. e.g. in Arlington), that’s not that bad.

  5. JoshJones on November 3rd, 2011 5:43 pm

    Yeah i’ve heard those numbers but id be suprised if he got that much. There’s not enough teams willing or able to spend that much and there’s a couple low cost options behind Pujols and Fielder such as Derek Lee, Carlos Pena, Cuddyer, Casey Kotchman,

    200 million over 8 years… which is 25 mil a season

    Thats worst case scenario. Yet still is a good deal. Fielder has consistently been a +5WAR player.

  6. Valenica on November 3rd, 2011 6:13 pm

    …I just had a better idea.

    Why not get both Votto AND Fielder?

    Snyder, McGehee, Pagan, Volstad, Bedard, Moyer = $17 million.

    Fielder’s expected to cost $22 million/7 years IMO, so that would put our payroll at $98-99 million. We can move Vargas for nothing if we really have to keep payroll down.

    Trade Smoak for Logan Morrison or another good OF bat with an issue.

    Ackley, Morrison, Votto, Fielder
    Ichiro, Gutierrez, Ryan, Olivo, Seager

    Once Hultzen and Paxton come up we could be legit. What’s a better MOTO than Votto/Fielder, with Ackley’s OBP before and Morrison’s power after?

  7. nwade on November 3rd, 2011 6:31 pm

    Chris – I get where you’re coming from, I just respectfully disagree that Dave’s *that* inflexible. But maybe its because I’ve only been following Dave for 2.5 years and haven’t seen a big enough sample-size? Maybe I’m just too used to dealing with difficult people and so I sympathize with Dave too readily. But when I see people throwing up statements on this thread the way they’ve been doing, *I* get annoyed, too! Many of the responses feel no different than if someone just piped up with a random comment like “We can’t get Votto – we have to trade Felix so we’re not over-paying for pitching. THEN we can have enough money to build a winning team!”

    The problem with such a statement is that there’s no reasoning behind it. In that example statement I gave, I do not explain how I arrived at the conclusion that we are currently over-paying for pitching. And I do not show how spending less on pitching would actually make the club better.

    This is why I posted the quote of the Monty Python sketch in the first place… There’s a WORLD of difference between making a random unsupported claim, and actually building a reasoned, logical argument. A good debate or quality conversation needs to be based on the latter; not the former. Every human has an opinion about everything. And in a democracy, everyone has an equal voice. But not everyone is equally qualified in all topics, and so not everyone’s voice should carry equal weight. Well-reasoned arguments with solid explanation help determine who’s opinion is worth giving weight to. There’s a reason you don’t listen to the crazy guy on the corner who tells you to wear a tinfoil hat to block out the Alien mind-control signals. OK, there are probably _many_ reasons, but one of the big ones is because his claims don’t seem to be based in fact and he doesn’t build a case the convinces you to take him seriously.

  8. JoshJones on November 3rd, 2011 6:32 pm

    Why not get both Votto AND Fielder?

    Snyder, McGehee, Pagan, Volstad, Bedard, Moyer = $17 million.

    We wouldn’t even crack the top 5 for team spending.

  9. rth1986 on November 3rd, 2011 7:01 pm

    Interesting post. While I, and many others, may disagree on some aspects, it’s always really fun to read these ideas. Keep them coming..

    One note on your WAR predictions…Seems to me you’re undervaluing Brendan Ryan and overvaluing Justin Smoak by about 1 WAR each. Doesn’t really matter, but I just thought it was interesting. Ryan seems a sure bet for about 2.5 WAR, given that he’s almost guaranteed to have a .295 wOBA and 10-15 DRS next year. On the other hand, getting 2 WAR from Smoak at DH seems optimistic. From my calculations, he’d have to post a .360 wOBA in a full season to get 2 WAR exclusively at DH. Would love for that production, but I think it’s a little optimistic. I’d only feel comfortable penciling him in for a .330-.340 wOBA next year.

    That aside, I really like the players you’ve targetted. Personally, I think the package for Votto is TOO much. 1B/DH isn’t really the primary position of long-term need for this club. I’d much rather the M’s target a short-term guy like David Ortiz while Carp and Smoak get more seasoning.

    If I were to trade Pineda or League, I’d be targetting a long-term 3B or catching option. I wonder if the Reds would go for a Pineda / Yasmani Grandal + Juan Francisco deal. That sounds much more appealing. League, subsequently, could be flipped for a separate useful prospect. But I personally wouldn’t trade away League yet. The bullpen is VERY young.

    Also, I LOVE Angel Pagan, but do you really think Cesar Jimenez would be all it takes? Why do you think the Mets would non-tender him? Pagan is dirt cheap for his value, and I think the Mets GM recognizes that. Probably Trayvon Robinson and Alex Liddi might be a fairer package for Pagan.

    I like Casey McGehee, but I don’t think he’s worth Carp. I think he could be had for cheap. I’d also be checking out Martin Prado, who is very similar to McGehee but with more defensive value. He had a down year in Atlanta and it seems they’re willing to move him.

  10. Valenica on November 3rd, 2011 7:14 pm

    Angel Pagan is rumored to be non-tendered, as “the new front office has not been impressed with his play,” and if that’s the case they might consider moving him for some BP depth.

    Martin Prado’s an interesting candidate for 3B. 2 arb years left, 3B/LF/2B flexibility, expected to make $4.4 million~, hit 118 wRC+ 2 of the last 3 years (8.2 WAR in 3 years). Braves are looking for power OF and a new SS – Ryan/Wells sounds like a perfect match. He’ll be 28 years old. Much higher upside than McGehee, about similar cost. We’ll have to check if Seager can play adequate SS though.

  11. rth1986 on November 3rd, 2011 8:49 pm

    Interesting about Pagan. Seems strange that the Mets FO would feel that way.

    An alternative to Pagan would be Coco Crisp. Pretty similar players. He wants to stay on the west coast and probably won’t cost too much.

    Oh, and I definitely don’t see the Mariners trading Ryan anytime soon. Maybe one of Wells/Saunders/Robinson/Peguero (?) would start the conversation with the Braves for Prado.

  12. Chris_From_Bothell on November 3rd, 2011 9:06 pm

    nwade, fair points all around.

  13. Valenica on November 3rd, 2011 9:17 pm

    We wouldn’t even crack the top 5 for team spending.

    Exactly. We could have Felix, Votto, and Fielder, and we won’t even spend $100 million if we do it right.

  14. jjracoon on November 3rd, 2011 9:32 pm

    Two things:

    Rodney says: While Votto has put up great numbers in Cincy, he’s NOT a good fit for Safeco. Votto led the league in opposite field homeruns last year.

    What you would be implying then is Smoak is more of a power hitter since he DID launch several opposite field homers out of SAFECO. Good hitters generate the necessary power to carry out and if not out would produce a lot of gappers.

    It is sad that it has been so long since we had a good hitter other than Ichiro that we pin hopes on Ackley. He reminds me a lot of John Olerud in his patience and eye at the plate but you wouldnt build your team around Olerud or Ackley. He is just a piece that needs complementary parts. Votto could be one of them of a higher level but I guess I’ve watched the Mariners so long only have one top tier starting pitcher that it is hard to give up Pineda. Maybe he wont end up being anything close to Felix as he progresses but the alternative would be Felix blows out his arm in spring training and Vargas is your Nr 1. He is a nice insurance policy until all this young talent is ready. Maybe in July the planets would align to trade him and bring up a couple of the young ones.

    Figure a package out for Grandal & Alonso seems easier and cheaper.

    Alonso DH/1st
    Carp LF or use him in a trade like suggested by Dave. I know most people dont want him in LF.
    Smoak 1st/DH

  15. MrZDevotee on November 3rd, 2011 10:11 pm

    While we debate all this, the most optimistic I’ve been in a LONG TIME comes from watching all the manuevering the front office has been doing to free up space on the 40 man roster over the past week. We ARE going to make moves. It seems clear. What if Jack was to approach this with a dual method of…

    A) insisting to the front office that he needs more money, because the retreads method is not working, and as evidenced by the 2nd half of last year, the minor leaguers aren’t quite ready yet– all this with the idea, or sales pitch, that as the farm teams start producing MLB starters, we can liquidate (flip) free agents accordingly and actually CUT payroll moving forward…

    B) plus, imagine the sort of moves he might be capable of if Jack gets it in his head that this might be his last year if this team doesn’t get at least CLOSE to contending, and he goes “all in” with his attempts to build a contender…? Imagine he’s able to sell the front office on the idea of WE NEED TO WIN NOW! Winning will attract winners to this organization– while, waving money and promising a friendly clubhouse alone hasn’t been enough to attract them when you’re tucked up away in the far reaches of the NW! We need TALENT!

    Now put the two together and maybe there are more moves coming than we have dared to hope. (Fingers crossed)

    I can actually picture Z giving the front office an ultimatum… “We’re in a lousy situation, and need impact players to turn this around… The kids aren’t ready yet, and the retreads are simply “re”-treading water for us… I need better players. You can get on board with me about this, or I can move on… And trust me, there are plenty of other organizations out there who will like the idea, if you don’t… I’m THROUGH losing.”

    I mean, maybe Dave is UNDERSELLING his Plan A? (Imagine that for a moment… Ow.) Go get ’em, Z!!!

    **Okay, okay, so this is just a fantasy… but “what if?”**

  16. MrZDevotee on November 3rd, 2011 10:17 pm

    On the original note…

    Any chance Cincy would be interested in Smoak as part of a deal? Someone mentioned it, and it makes sense… Why not move Smoak? Since most of the large return moves were talking about involve 1B? Don’t get me wrong, I like Smoak– a LOT– but if we’re gonna acquire a 1B, then Smoak is one of the more valuable guys to move on the roster to help ease the burden. It would seem to make more sense than moving Carp, because Smoak is more readily an everyday player, and hence a more valuable trading chip.

    Yes? No? Maybe?

  17. Valenica on November 3rd, 2011 10:40 pm

    Cincy would have no interest in Smoak because they already have Alonso blocked by Votto. They’re teaching Alonso how to play LF but it’s not pretty…it’s probably more for flexibility in case they keep both Alonso and Votto.

    The option that makes the most sense for Smoak is Florida with LF Logan Morrison. Florida and Morrison have a small feud going, and if they’re given the opportunity to unload Morrison for a bat like Smoak, I think they’ll concede.

  18. Bodhizefa on November 4th, 2011 12:25 am

    Smoak isn’t work jack squat at this point. Selling him now would be the epitome of the sell low mantra, and that’s something the M’s as currently constructed cannot afford. Trading Smoak would be a dumb move for a team looking to get as much offensive upside as possible right now, and it’s doubly dumb since his value is (hopefully) as low as it will ever be.

    I actually prefer Dave’s mid-season notion of swapping Pineda and League to the Reds for Alonso, Grandal, Travis Wood, and Juan Francisco. My own belief is that the Reds will not accept Pineda and League for Votto, so the alternative is to get a lot of average and above average talent from them for Pineda since they seem to have good depth.

    To those arguing we should deal Pineda for a third baseman, well, have you seen the state of third base in baseball right now? It’s easy to say “Go trade our valuable guy for this specific position,” but it’s another thing entirely when not a single team out there has a decent young third baseman they could afford to give up. The only chance I think we have at getting a legit star at third base this off-season is if we pony up for David Wright, but he’d only be signed for one season if we do that. That seems like it’d be a waste assuming the cost to acquire him from the Mets would be a pretty penny. I’d only advocate that if we could sign him to a long-term deal.

  19. Valenica on November 4th, 2011 12:37 am

    That’s a complete overpay by the Reds. If they decide to contend now, and want to trade Alonso, Grandal, Wood, and Francisco for arms, they’ll be better off dealing them for 2-3 arms then just Pineda + League. Pineda’s value comes from his cost-control – if the Reds are selling to win-now, they’ll be looking to maximize wins now, so SP2-3s with 1-2 year left on their contract. Sadly we don’t have any of those.

    Also, Ryan Zimmerman. He’s in the exact same situation as Joey Votto, being too old for the core (Harper, Strasburg), has a backup in place (Rendon), but too good to just give away…unless convinced. He actually might sign an extension though, unlike Votto, so we’ll see.

  20. cougarcountry on November 4th, 2011 1:26 am

    I guess it’s good to see Dave is back to his usual self.

    It’s hard to understand why a guy who puts himself out there for the public to read is so quick to point out that he doesn’t have the time or desire to deal with the public and treats his readers with such disdain. It doesn’t make for very good blogging. This is the last time I’ll be checking in. Lots of other writers out there with just as good or better insight with half the attitude and petulance.

  21. terry on November 4th, 2011 5:49 am

    This is the last time I’ll be checking in.

    Thanks for adding absolutely nothing and don’t let the door hit you on the way out.

  22. B13a on November 4th, 2011 6:46 am

    I don’t think Votto will be traded (although I’m not ruling it out, that would be foolish), but I prefer acquiring him over Fielder. While I do like his bat, I prefer players with other upside (team control, fielding ability).

    There’s also the case of body type. Completely subjective I think, so eh. At any case, acquiring either player would be cool, even with the knowledge that Fielder will probably take up all the money Z has to use in the budget.

  23. Gibbo on November 4th, 2011 9:11 am

    On Fielder I agree with the last post, I would only go get him if the FO was to give more money as there are other more important areas of need. I think they know with Felix on the roster they need to start winning.

    I like the Volstad idea. Also these trades are subjective so I don’t see why everyone gets so wound up. You know if someone wrote what we gave up to get Lee before the trade happened we would of all scoffed and said your crazy. The other point is, isn’t Bavasi still with the Reds? If so Dave, you are over paying.

    Thanks for the post and for making the effort. This site is one of the reasons that got me hooked on Baseball and the M’s. An addiction that made a single guy living in New Zealand having never seen a game of baseball, get on a plane and travel across the states watching this great game and my favoutite team. Now a few years later, married with a child. This is still the first baseball site I come to for thoughts and opinions on the Mariners and we a planning a trip to Seattle so my girls can share the love.

    Sorry for the non baseball ramble, thanks again.

  24. JoshJones on November 4th, 2011 9:28 am

    I guess it’s good to see Dave is back to his usual self.

    It’s hard to understand why a guy who puts himself out there for the public to read is so quick to point out that he doesn’t have the time or desire to deal with the public and treats his readers with such disdain. It doesn’t make for very good blogging. This is the last time I’ll be checking in. Lots of other writers out there with just as good or better insight with half the attitude and petulance.

    USS Mariner and Dave specifically have great insight on the Mariners organization and provide a great format to discuss a variety of topics. Unfortunately, I agree with everything you say.

    Thanks for adding absolutely nothing and don’t let the door hit you on the way out.

    This isn’t your typical blogging site. It’s more of a community of fans who blog and interact on a daily basis with one another. I don’t think it’s to much to ask the authors specifically to be a little more respectful.

  25. Chris_From_Bothell on November 4th, 2011 9:45 am

    The other point is, isn’t Bavasi still with the Reds? If so Dave, you are over paying.

    I don’t think we can assume Bavasi will automatically make bad trades all day every day just because he did several clunkers here. He might have learned, he might have different personalities / levels of competence above him that could veto or alter deals, etc.

  26. greymstreet on November 4th, 2011 9:55 am


    I don’t know if you’re still monitoring this thread, but any chance we could get thumbs up/down buttons like on Fangraphs. There are a bunch of comments here that could use a good thumbs down…

  27. nwade on November 4th, 2011 1:23 pm

    This isn’t your typical blogging site. It’s more of a community of fans who blog and interact on a daily basis with one another.

    Uh, no. Its a blogging site. It feels like a community of fans because Dave and the other Authors here have put out consistently good information and attracted a lot of those fans.

    And speaking of that content/information, let me raise this question: How much money have you paid in order to read this content? As far as I know, its free. So this feeling of entitlement some folks have is just baffling. You didn’t pay for this service. If you like the content, then consider it a gift that Dave and the other authors are giving you. And if you don’t like the content, then this site is just like any other blog site: Its a place where someone spouts their opinion, and if you don’t like it you don’t have to read it. I’m not saying this to be snotty, I’m just saying it because its the simple truth.

    As for the authors – I hope they take enjoyment from the analysis and discoveries that their research brings them; and that sense of discovery and satisfaction drives them more than the stuff people (like me) post in the comments area! 🙂

  28. Matt the Dragon on November 4th, 2011 4:49 pm

    I don’t think it’s to much to ask the authors specifically to be a little more respectful.

    But is it too much to ask commenters to be respectable.

  29. neo-realist on November 4th, 2011 11:05 pm

    Furthermore, for the 2012 mlb draft, select, if he’s available, Nick Williams–tremendous power bat upside.

  30. bfgboy on November 5th, 2011 1:08 pm

    I just read that talks between Royals and Braves have stalled. Braves are looking to package Jai Jurrjens and Martin Prado for Lornezo Cain and Will Myers, but KC only wants Jurrjens and feels that Myers is too much to give up (considering it would add $4 mil to payroll). What about if M’s sent Cesar Jiminez to KC, and Prado came here? Atlanta is looking to shed salary, and they were already content with shipping him to KC, plus KC gets two solid pitchers in the deal. Maybe it could even be expanded in some way to bring Gordon here.

  31. Bodhizefa on November 6th, 2011 6:16 am

    It amazes me how stupid some people can be when it comes to trades. And no, I’m not talking about Dave at all. I’m talking about some of the ridiculous commenters on here who want to shovel off shit for gold. It’s maddening to have to read some of this trash.

    My personal opinion is that every time you post, you should have to answer a series of three questions all pertaining to the viability of a random trade generated by a computer program. If you miss any of the questions (i.e. if your trade “barometer” is off in any way), your post is deleted and you aren’t allowed to comment for 12 hours. Also, the program would mock you by laughing at you in Nelson’s voice from the Simpsons.

  32. 15thBanker on November 6th, 2011 10:01 pm

    I can’t get past the McGehee trade. Might as well keep Carp and stick him on third. And what exactly did McGehee accomplish this year that warrants getting a $2 mil raise??

  33. jwcincy on November 7th, 2011 5:54 pm

    I can’t see Cincinnati going for that deal, I only see something like Michael Pineda, League, Paxson, Seager, Tryvon Robinson, and another minor league prospect to get Votto and Grandal, but I do see them shopping him cause they only signed him to a 3 year deal cause he is going to demand a lot of money when that contract ends, and they can’t afford him after that! I do believe that the Mariners need to step up and do something like this, and give the team soome power!

  34. Dayve on November 7th, 2011 6:28 pm

    Are you just making stuff up so that people here don’t have a clue as to what you’re talking about? I mean, Jamie Moyer and Erik Beddard? For 5 Million? Huh?

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