Game 14, Indians at Mariners

Dave · April 19, 2012 at 6:17 pm · Filed Under Mariners 

Hernandez vs Tomlin, 7:10 pm.

Happy Felix Day!

From Shannon Drayer’s blog:

“Miggy is our starting catcher, Jesus is going to get time as well, it is going to be tough to get Jaso back there,” he said. “Not that I am against it but right now I feel like I need to give the time to Miggy and Jesus. I still want to get Jaso’s bat in the lineup from time to time if I can so that is what we are trying to do.”

I asked Wedge going with Olivo was more about what he does behind the plate or getting his bat going.

“We’re trying to get it going,” he answered. “I have had conversations with him. I was really pleased with what he did this spring he’s working up the middle more, he is trying to go the other way which is against what you have seen from him in the past typically. He has done a nice job with it. I think he has been a little anxious here early on I think he has been pressing a little bit but his confidence hasn’t wavered and I feel he is going to hit but he just has to do some things in an adjustment period to make that happen.”

I guess my kudos towards Wedge were premature. He really has no idea that Miguel Olivo is a terrible baseball player, or that John Jaso would give the Mariners a better chance of winning. Fantastic.

By and large, managers don’t really matter much. They really only need to be able to do a few things decently well – correctly identify the guys on the team who should play the most often, keep order in the clubhouse, and don’t be a total tool to the media. Wedge seems to be just fine at the last two, but he’s awful at the first one. He’s not the only problem with this team, obviously, but just pretending that he isn’t one isn’t useful either.

Figgins, LF
Ackley, 2B
Ichiro, RF
Smoak, 1B
Seager, 3B
Saunders, CF
Olivo, C
Jaso, DH
Ryan, SS

Comments

199 Responses to “Game 14, Indians at Mariners”

  1. greentunic on April 19th, 2012 6:26 pm

    You know Dave I try not to be a mindless clone follower of your logic all the time, but if you’re trying to maximize productivity from this team, playing Olivo is just wrong. I’m not following you so much as just saying you’re right!

    Jaso is younger, better with the bat, better at defense (minus maybe throwing), cheaper, and a more likely fit for the future. It seems like this is just Wedge’s way of deliberately giving us all the finger.

    On a side note, I’ve meant to ask you, Dave. Who would you say has been your primary inspiration for how you look at baseball. Is it Bill James, Billy Beane, a former stats professor, a Fangraphs founder, Bill Krueger (haha). I just want to know, because I love your insight and would like to know its origin a bit.

  2. Ross on April 19th, 2012 6:26 pm

    Dave, I love you. But really. What’s he supposed to say to the press? He could spout some BS like Bobby Valentine, but what would good would that do? I’m sure the M’s would like to trade Miggy and get the most value for him. What good would benching him do for his trade value? Nothing. So, you put him out there, let him do his thing, and come July 31, maybe you get something for your troubles.

  3. FelixFanChris420 on April 19th, 2012 6:27 pm

    how long does this go on before it becomes appropriate for the local media (both print and blog) to start calling for Wedge’s head? Personally I’m ready to see him gone now, but I’m curious what more knowledgable folks then myself think about it…

  4. greentunic on April 19th, 2012 6:27 pm

    I don’t see Miggy getting any trade value. The risk just seems to much for what little value can be had for a catcher like Miggy for half a year, even at his best. My two cents.

  5. FelixFanChris420 on April 19th, 2012 6:30 pm

    I think we’d have to give a prospect along with olivo to even get salary relief.

  6. msfanmike on April 19th, 2012 6:31 pm

    Ross, the point is to field the best lineup possible to give your team the best chance to win … Every day. Consistently not doing that falls into the “you can’t fix stupid” category.

    Grandpa was right.

  7. Snuffleupagus on April 19th, 2012 6:34 pm

    The idea that Olivo is being shopped for trade value has really run its course. How could he possibly generate any value? Get on a hot streak for a week or two?

    He is a known quantity. His value is what it is, it won’t fluxuate based on a few weeks or even months of playing.

    This whole thing has completely soured me to Wedge. Call for his head.

  8. terryoftacoma on April 19th, 2012 6:34 pm

    Before the season started I picked this team to be South of .500. We are game above and I’m pleased with that. I, also, wanted to see the kids play. So far the kids are playing. Do we have weak spots? Sure. For the most part I’m happy to watch these games and give Jack a chance to fix the weak spots as we go along or later. In the mean time I enjoy watching the games again and that’s a change.

  9. Cody on April 19th, 2012 6:48 pm

    Obviously you can yell at the little kid for running with scissors, but at some point the person who left them in a place of access needs to be accountable.

  10. Sports on a Schtick on April 19th, 2012 6:49 pm

    Good to hear Adam Moore is only out a couple months and not the whole season. Don’t think he has a future with the M’s (even with our disastrous catcher situation…) but the guy deserves some good luck.

  11. Nate on April 19th, 2012 6:50 pm

    So this game is the free game of the day on MLB right? Is that gonna trump the Blackout rules?

    Sincerely,
    -Spokane, WA

  12. terryoftacoma on April 19th, 2012 6:52 pm

    I doubt it, Nate. Probably the A’s and Angels on MLBN.

  13. gag harbor on April 19th, 2012 6:57 pm

    With some teams, the owner meddles with personnel issues. In the case of the Mariners, we can’t even get the GM to stick his nose into starting line ups from time to time? There should be an edict that Jaso gets some work behind the plate as a hedge against Olivo’s troubling trends.

  14. djw on April 19th, 2012 7:00 pm

    I’m sure the M’s would like to trade Miggy and get the most value for him. What good would benching him do for his trade value? Nothing. So, you put him out there, let him do his thing, and come July 31, maybe you get something for your troubles.

    Miguel Olivo is a worse baseball player than very close to all current backup catchers currently on major league baseball rosters. He has no trade value whatsoever. The mindset that you could potentially trade him for any sort of prospect or salary relief in 2012 is patently absurd. The baseball IQ of front offices has increased dramatically in the last decade; this sort of mentality is very outdated.

  15. Paul B on April 19th, 2012 7:00 pm

    I knew we had a problem last year when it became obvious Wedge only uses stats available in 1960 when evaluating hitters.

  16. just a fan on April 19th, 2012 7:02 pm

    If Wedge has a different way of valuing who should catch, that’s what it is. Jaso doesn’t have a stellar reputation himself. And today is Felix Day which means Olivo is catching because that’s who Felix wants catching.

    But why does Wedge have John Jaso batting behind Olivo?

    Hopefully John Jaso takes this as yet another challenge and hits a Grand Slam. Next time he’ll have to hit two.

  17. Paul B on April 19th, 2012 7:05 pm

    I was playing with baseball-reference today and noticed that Felix is already the Mariner all-time leader in wild pitches.

    Throwing to Rob Johnson and Miguel Olivo will do that.

  18. TherzAlwaysHope on April 19th, 2012 7:06 pm

    For those wishing Fister was still around, he has pitched only 3 2/3 this season. Costochondral muscle trouble. He has had a setback with his rehab and is day to day.

  19. djw on April 19th, 2012 7:10 pm

    Damn Rangers won’t stop hitting. I can’t get the game here until this stupid Rangers game is over.

  20. terryoftacoma on April 19th, 2012 7:10 pm

    Play ball!!

  21. Dustbust on April 19th, 2012 7:11 pm

    I’d bet Wedge is giving Olivo every chance to produce before he’s benched or released. Benching a veteran, who’s as well established as Olivo may send the wrong message to our young team. He did the same thing with Cust and Bradley last year.

    Montero has also been a little too happy with the stick, and should probably watch a game or two.

    Side note: Adam Jones has 5 home runs. It still stings…

  22. Paul B on April 19th, 2012 7:14 pm

    So running the worst player on the roster out there night after night sends a good message to the team?

    How does that work, again?

  23. Logger on April 19th, 2012 7:16 pm

    @Paul B,

    Yeah, but I imagine that Wedge isn’t the only person in the M’s dugout that doesn’t think Olivo is the worst player out there.

  24. georgmi on April 19th, 2012 7:17 pm

    Yeah, we can’t be sending the message that “performance matters”. Think what that would do to morale.

  25. just a fan on April 19th, 2012 7:18 pm

    Olivo must do something behind the scenes that we don’t see. Like, preparation and knowing how to pitch to each batter, maybe he’s good at settling pitchers down.

    Because we know that he can’t catch, and he increasingly can’t hit. Yet pitchers seem to like pitching to him.

  26. Paul B on April 19th, 2012 7:20 pm

    I bet some of the young players have heard of OPS or WAR, and if not, certainly they’ve heard of on base percentage and slugging average.

  27. Paul B on April 19th, 2012 7:22 pm

    just, that’s exactly what people said about Rob Johnson.

  28. Dustbust on April 19th, 2012 7:22 pm

    Wedge values hard work and respecting the game. Like it or not Olivo does both of those things. If Wedge wants those values instilled in his team, that would sure explain the playing time.

  29. Logger on April 19th, 2012 7:22 pm

    Among the many things Figgins should be doing differently, he really needs to cut down on the strikeouts.

  30. just a fan on April 19th, 2012 7:23 pm

    Paul, I know. We just need a catcher who puts in a lot of effort, prepares well, works great with pitchers…

    AND can catch the ball and knows how to hit.

  31. djw on April 19th, 2012 7:24 pm

    Olivo must do something behind the scenes that we don’t see

    You’re overthinking this. Wedge is an atrocious evaluator of talent. We don’t need an elaborate, improbable explanation.

    Heck, there were people here who called Olivo “above average” as a hitting catcher because of his HR and RBI (!!!) totals last year. And plenty more all over the media. We’re not that far removed from that. It’s an idiotic mistake, but a not-uncommon and fairly normal one.

  32. MrZDevotee on April 19th, 2012 7:26 pm

    Patience is a virtue, when it comes to rebuilding, and sometimes doesn’t generate lots of headlines…

    Recent trades–

    MARINERS have:
    Charlie Furbush
    Casper Wells
    Francisco Martinez
    Chance Ruffin

    TIGERS have:
    very little of Doug Fister at the moment

    MARINERS have:
    Jesus Montero
    Hector Noesi

    YANKEES have:
    very little of Michael Pineda
    Jose Campos is KILLING IT (sigh)

    MARINERS have:
    Justin Smoak
    Blake Beavan
    John Jaso (sort of, via Lueke)

    TEXAS have:
    (zilch)

    Small sample size so far in the two recent trades, but so far, gotta read these as we’re winning the big trades (until Campos becomes the best pitcher in baseball, then it balances out a bit).

  33. just a fan on April 19th, 2012 7:29 pm

    MRZ – Texas has 2010 AL Pennant

  34. Paul B on April 19th, 2012 7:29 pm

    You have to remember, Wedge squandered 155 plate appearances on Peguero last year because he honestly thought he was ready to be a major league hitter.

  35. Logger on April 19th, 2012 7:29 pm

    You also have to consider the prospects that Texas drafted with the draft picks they received as compensation for Lee signing with Philly.

  36. djw on April 19th, 2012 7:33 pm

    So how’s Felix looking tonight? I’m still stuck watching the 8th inning that won’t end in Detroit….

  37. just a fan on April 19th, 2012 7:33 pm

    Look at him block that ball that was almost in the dirt!

  38. Paul B on April 19th, 2012 7:33 pm

    Results are good, movement looks good.

  39. Paul B on April 19th, 2012 7:35 pm

    [using gay in the pejorative]

  40. marinerbullpen on April 19th, 2012 7:37 pm

    Seriously, can we talk less about “Olivo”
    My gosh, 2/3 of the comments mention the displeasure of Wedge playing Olivo. Ok, I get it, I’d like to see Jaso at least once at catcher, and Montero at least 1/3 of the time.

    As mentioned above, Felix wants Olivo as his catcher tonight. I have no idea how Felix feels, but if Felix really wants Olivo, then there must be SOMETHING that Olivo gives.

  41. Paul B on April 19th, 2012 7:39 pm

    I’ve seen one pitch by Felix @ 93, and several @ 92.

  42. MrZDevotee on April 19th, 2012 7:39 pm

    Paul-
    It is a happy commercial, isn’t it. It’s festive too. Julie Andrews should fly through in the background.

  43. Paul B on April 19th, 2012 7:41 pm

    If you want to discuss something, you should post about it,. Creating only a post about xyz to complain there are too many posts about xyz?

  44. terryoftacoma on April 19th, 2012 7:42 pm

    Let the cussing begin.

  45. henryv on April 19th, 2012 7:42 pm

    F— you Miguel Olivo.

  46. WTF_Ms on April 19th, 2012 7:42 pm

    “Miggy” in the lineup is paying off already!

  47. msfanmike on April 19th, 2012 7:43 pm

    Personally, I am astounded by that outcome.

  48. terryoftacoma on April 19th, 2012 7:43 pm

    Damn I can read minds..

  49. josephvalentino on April 19th, 2012 7:44 pm

    Does anyone know why Iwakuma has not pitched this season? I know he had a rough spring but…

  50. henryv on April 19th, 2012 7:44 pm

    Either that, or you heard me from 30 miles away, Terry.

  51. Ichirolling51 on April 19th, 2012 7:44 pm

    Can you have your DH hit for another position other than pitcher? Because if you can, we should have the DH for our catcher.

  52. Paul B on April 19th, 2012 7:44 pm

    I always liked Hannahan but I’m glad we have Seater.,

  53. MrZDevotee on April 19th, 2012 7:45 pm

    Bullpen,
    Olivo was like on cue with your comment, it was almost like a comedy skit…

    “If Bruce Dickinson (Wedge) says MORE COWBELL (Olivo) well who am I to say different… Let’s give the man MORE COWBELL…”

    (clunk! clunk! clunk! clunk into double play)!

  54. just a fan on April 19th, 2012 7:45 pm

    Obviously should’ve just sent Seager. I’m a moron and I saw that coming.

  55. Paul B on April 19th, 2012 7:46 pm

    Seager.

  56. MrZDevotee on April 19th, 2012 7:47 pm

    (using Wedge reasoning)
    “Guys, he’s gonna pull out of this. Relax. JASO, GO SIT THE F___ DOWN!!!”

    (so players are to be held accountable, or suffer the consequences, but managers aren’t– am I right in this assumption?)

  57. Ichirolling51 on April 19th, 2012 7:47 pm

    My God this Rangers game will not fucking end, and MLB Network is too damn stubborn to switch over to the M’s game. It has taken almost an hour and a half for the last two innings, and the game has been over since the 5th inning. God I hate the Rangers, they annoy me even when not playing the Mariners.

  58. henryv on April 19th, 2012 7:49 pm

    Holding people accountable for sucking is stupid. You get rid of people who suck. Olivo isn’t good. You can hold him accountable all you want, but it’s not going to make him any better at baseball.

  59. nvn8vbryce on April 19th, 2012 7:50 pm

    You know, if it takes Olivo to see the results were seeing from Felix so far tonight, I’m ok with overlooking his obvious issues with the bat. 5k’s thus far is nothing to sneeze at.

  60. MrZDevotee on April 19th, 2012 7:51 pm

    Ichirolling-
    I hate the Rangers as much as the next guy, but a tiny part of me warms up to them when they’re thumping on the Red Sox (that was a thing of beauty)…

  61. MrZDevotee on April 19th, 2012 7:53 pm

    henryv-
    In my book “holding accountable” means benching his ass, especially with two better options, or yeah, cutting him. Maybe that wasn’t clear.

  62. msfanmike on April 19th, 2012 7:53 pm

    Anytime I hear or see a cowbell, I have immediate Will Ferrell flashbacks. Probably the funniest skit he ever had on SNL … So thanks for that reminder GMZ.

  63. Ichirolling51 on April 19th, 2012 7:54 pm

    Now MLBN is fucking covering the game, and giving analysis after the game ended wtf?

    I need more patience…

  64. MrZDevotee on April 19th, 2012 7:56 pm

    nvn8vbryce-
    So you’re saying Felix wouldn’t be doing as well without Olivo behind the plate?

    (Not being snide, just sort of pointing out that he’d probably do okay without him, too… so I’m not sure I punt on catching the ball and hitting it, for whatever advantage we imagine Olivo affords Felix’s abilities.)

  65. marcus_andrews on April 19th, 2012 7:57 pm

    I don’t think Felix “needs” Miguel Olivo, I mean last year Olivo caught him basically all the time and it was a down year for him. And if he does want a personal catcher that’s fine, but it should be one day every five, not four out of five.

    With all that said, he does look great today.

  66. casey on April 19th, 2012 7:57 pm

    Danny Hultzen and Jackson bullpen throw one hit shutout tonight. If all three continue on this pace going to be fun to see who might move up the quickest, keep saying Paxton (who is oldest) but have always read how advanced Hultzen is and then there is Walker with the Dwight Gooden / young Felix stuff.

  67. nvn8vbryce on April 19th, 2012 7:59 pm

    I’m sure he’d probably be OK with whoever is behind the plate, that being said, is he more comfortable behind the plate tonight? It looks like it to me.

  68. Paul B on April 19th, 2012 8:00 pm

    Is anyone else getting a radio feed on this web page?

  69. henryv on April 19th, 2012 8:03 pm

    MZD, I think Olivo needs a straight release, or a trade where we pay his whole contract for a high-A guy, if we can get it. But Olivo needs to be out of this organization. He is a lazy catcher who doesn’t move his feet.

  70. G-Man on April 19th, 2012 8:04 pm

    No feed here for me. Check another tab or window.

    A Jeff Gray sighting! I didn’t know he’s with the Twins. He gave up Curtis Granderson’s third home run of the game tonight in the 4th inning (yes, that’s right).

    OK, so you don’t CARE he’s with the Twins…

  71. Paul B on April 19th, 2012 8:04 pm

    That was strange. I was hearing a recap of Yanks-Twins.. Closed it and reopened and it went away.

  72. marinerbullpen on April 19th, 2012 8:04 pm

    @MrZ. Yes, I dislike Olivo a lot. I just want to talk about it less. Glad to see him hit into the DP, only hoping it will lead to his dismissal. Like real soon. But I doubt it.

    Cow Bell, love it.

    Montero, hope he has a PH opportunity tonight, seeing Felix dominate, while we can’t push one across against frigging josh tomlin. REALLY.

    I’m old, I saw the Pilots play.

    Hoping for something before time runs out, I just want to focus on something positive. Like we are 7-6 and have played 8 road games.

  73. juneau_fan on April 19th, 2012 8:05 pm

    Radio feed > Yes.

  74. IdahoFan on April 19th, 2012 8:06 pm

    In the midst of all this love for our catcher, don’t forget to appreciate how good Felix looks tonight. He is dealing.

  75. henryv on April 19th, 2012 8:07 pm

    If your hurt Dustin Ackley, we will force you to work in Starbucks.

  76. nvn8vbryce on April 19th, 2012 8:08 pm

    That was stupid, Dustin.

  77. IdahoInvader on April 19th, 2012 8:09 pm

    Jeff Gray recently got two wins w/ just three pitches lol. The ultimate vulture

  78. MrZDevotee on April 19th, 2012 8:10 pm

    Bullpen-

    My positive grasp is that we’re one run (in Arlington) and that blown game two nights ago from being 9-5 (wouldn’t that have been a gas…)

    They’re playing their hearts out, and at least wins seem possible this season.

  79. terryoftacoma on April 19th, 2012 8:11 pm

    Damn he hit that hard!

  80. Paul B on April 19th, 2012 8:13 pm

    That sure looked like a crap call, before I saw the replay.

  81. IdahoInvader on April 19th, 2012 8:13 pm

    At least no morons slid into first base today ;-)

  82. marcus_andrews on April 19th, 2012 8:13 pm

    How great would it be if Wedge got kicked out and our bench coach IMMEDIATELY pulled Olivo? Wouldn’t that just be hilarious?

  83. Paul B on April 19th, 2012 8:16 pm

    Adam Jones. :-(

  84. henryv on April 19th, 2012 8:16 pm

    Does anyone else think that David Lynch is now directing the Snoqualmie commercials?

  85. BillyJive on April 19th, 2012 8:17 pm

    Olivo better start hitting or they’ll move him to the clean-up spot!

  86. MrZDevotee on April 19th, 2012 8:17 pm

    Actually my bad– we’d be 9-4 with a little luck, not 9-5… A couple runs in that 0-1 loss to Texas (which would have split the series– wasn’t that the foul Saunders 3 run homer?) and holding onto the 7 run lead a couple nights back…

    We’d be 9-4. Progress seems at least within grasp.

    Felix is RAKING!!!

  87. msfanmike on April 19th, 2012 8:17 pm

    Kotchman is still a witch with that glove.

  88. IdahoFan on April 19th, 2012 8:18 pm

    Liking all the ground ball outs for Felix tonight.

  89. seattlesonsofbaseball on April 19th, 2012 8:18 pm

    That would be hilarious marcus! I’d laugh until my spleen erupted. But on a more serious note… I believe that Felix isn’t allowed to get runs, and that is dictated by the baseball gods. The most runs I’ve seen him get in the last 10 games he’s pitched was when he was given a 7-1 lead and almost gave THAT up. The god’s must have fallen asleep and noticed that Felix would have an easy day. After Smoak killing that ball and Kotchman coming out lucky and Seager ALMOST getting that hit, it is apparent that he’s not allowed any runs… ever. He could have the worst Win/Loss record for potential Hall of Famers in the history of the game.

  90. MrZDevotee on April 19th, 2012 8:20 pm

    Texas is truly going nuts… They’re gonna win a lot of games this year… Another 19 hits tonight. Damn.

  91. msfanmike on April 19th, 2012 8:20 pm

    If Oakland was not such an atrocious defensive team, the mariners record would probably be 5-8. Assuming you are interested in a wholistic perspective.

    Now, let’s get a couple runs

  92. IdahoInvader on April 19th, 2012 8:21 pm

    Cue the Benny Hill music

  93. djw on April 19th, 2012 8:21 pm

    Hey, Olivo did something right!

  94. Paul B on April 19th, 2012 8:21 pm

    Saunders doubled so he wouldn’t be doubled up by Olivo again.

  95. FelixFanChris420 on April 19th, 2012 8:22 pm

    Wow olivo did somthing right! That’s why he’s in the line up! Way felix is pitching, one might be enough :-)

  96. nvn8vbryce on April 19th, 2012 8:22 pm

    C’mon Jason, go shopping at the Gap…

  97. msfanmike on April 19th, 2012 8:23 pm

    Jingerheimerscmidt!

  98. Ichirolling51 on April 19th, 2012 8:23 pm

    I hate that we have to resort to small ball this early in games. The Rangers would never do such a thing. Makes me kind of jealous.

  99. nvn8vbryce on April 19th, 2012 8:23 pm

    Jason, not Jason

  100. Paul B on April 19th, 2012 8:23 pm

    Normally a successful sac bunt reduces the team’s chance of winning. But since it was Olivo, it was the right play.

  101. groundzero55 on April 19th, 2012 8:24 pm

    I’m sure relieved that Olivo is our starter, and it’ll be hard to get Jaso playing time.

  102. henryv on April 19th, 2012 8:24 pm

    If that throw is a little closer, there is going to be a really close play with a possible nasty collision.

  103. marinerbullpen on April 19th, 2012 8:25 pm

    How is that NOT an RBI for Jaso?
    I predict that will be changed later tonight.

  104. msfanmike on April 19th, 2012 8:25 pm

    Jinglehimerschmidt … My bad

  105. terryoftacoma on April 19th, 2012 8:30 pm

    We’re really aggressive on the basepaths tonight. Somebody better not get hurt.

  106. justdave on April 19th, 2012 8:31 pm

    Gameday doesn’t think Felix’s pitches are nasty.

  107. Paul B on April 19th, 2012 8:32 pm

    Good call, they changed it and gave Jaso an RBI.

  108. terryoftacoma on April 19th, 2012 8:32 pm

    Well, maybe one somebody.. kidding.

  109. Paul B on April 19th, 2012 8:35 pm

    Gamelan doesn’t do a good job with pitches.

  110. Paul B on April 19th, 2012 8:36 pm

    gameday.

  111. matto on April 19th, 2012 8:37 pm

    @marinerbullpen, it was changed by the bottom of 6th.

  112. terryoftacoma on April 19th, 2012 8:40 pm

    Hour and a half and were in the seventh. Didn’t it take that long for the Rangers to play two innings?

  113. marinerbullpen on April 19th, 2012 8:40 pm

    As it should have been. What was that Official Scorer thinking? Must have had been ….well, I can’t predict why, glad it was changed.

  114. Paul B on April 19th, 2012 8:44 pm

    Lucky that wasn’t a triple by Hafner. Figgy not a good line.

  115. terryoftacoma on April 19th, 2012 8:46 pm

    Felix!!!!!!

  116. FelixFanChris420 on April 19th, 2012 8:47 pm

    Chances Montero gets a PH appearance if Olivo comes up w/ RISP? Someone tell me its greater than zero…

  117. henryv on April 19th, 2012 8:47 pm

    Lucky that wasn’t a triple by Hafner. Figgy not a good line.

    Figgy was trying to keep it to a single, and is probably aware that Hafner isn’t likely to go for a triple on a liner to left.

    Holy smokes, I’m defending Figgy. Screenshot!

  118. terryoftacoma on April 19th, 2012 8:49 pm

    Done henryv haha

  119. just a fan on April 19th, 2012 8:50 pm

    OLIVO YEAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  120. nvn8vbryce on April 19th, 2012 8:51 pm

    Are my eyes failing me or did Miguel Olivo just hit a double in the gap?

  121. IdahoInvader on April 19th, 2012 8:52 pm

    Its like that Freaky Friday movie!! Olivo and Jaso switched bodies temporarily

  122. marcus_andrews on April 19th, 2012 8:52 pm

    If more Jaso playing time means more rolled over ground balls to second I don’t know that I love that either…

  123. FelixFanChris420 on April 19th, 2012 8:55 pm

    Marcus…even if it means far less balls rolling to the backstop…?

  124. nvn8vbryce on April 19th, 2012 8:55 pm

    I’m thinking Felix is done fairly soon…

  125. marcus_andrews on April 19th, 2012 8:57 pm

    Felix, good point.. But I don’t know that Jaso is ever going to catch so I don’t know that he will have any impact on that. Fair or not that’s what it seems like

  126. terryoftacoma on April 19th, 2012 9:04 pm

    Caught a break there. Why didn’t he run from third?

  127. justdave on April 19th, 2012 9:07 pm

    Whooo! Is there anything more nerve-wracking than a 1-0 lead?

  128. lalo on April 19th, 2012 9:07 pm

    I fucking love Felix Hernandez

  129. pdxMsfan on April 19th, 2012 9:07 pm

    I love skinny Felix!

  130. Swungonandbelted on April 19th, 2012 9:07 pm

    clutch.

  131. terryoftacoma on April 19th, 2012 9:08 pm

    Love it!!! Two nights in a row they load the bases and can’t score.. Woot!

  132. nvn8vbryce on April 19th, 2012 9:09 pm

    I’m cooking my crow right now…

  133. henryv on April 19th, 2012 9:09 pm

    If the M’s win this game, it might be the most exciting game in the last two seasons.

  134. WalterNeff on April 19th, 2012 9:11 pm

    Miggie and Wedge: If it wasn’t for managers falling in love with players of little value, Edgar would be in the Hall.

  135. justdave on April 19th, 2012 9:12 pm

    Crapola, I hope League is warming up.

  136. henryv on April 19th, 2012 9:12 pm

    Miggie and Wedge: If it wasn’t for managers falling in love with players of little value, Edgar would be in the Hall.

    That, and hamstrings. Stupid, stupid hamstrings.

  137. msfanmike on April 19th, 2012 9:14 pm

    C’mon Brandon … Work in the splitter.

  138. terryoftacoma on April 19th, 2012 9:17 pm

    League drives me crazy.

  139. Ichirolling51 on April 19th, 2012 9:18 pm

    Someone better put Felix on suicide watch if League blows this!

  140. msfanmike on April 19th, 2012 9:19 pm

    Double play time!

  141. Ichirolling51 on April 19th, 2012 9:20 pm

    Come on League don’t fucking ruin your trade stock.

  142. msfanmike on April 19th, 2012 9:21 pm

    Nice bunt by Kotchman. K this guy

  143. terryoftacoma on April 19th, 2012 9:21 pm

    Not likely with runners on second and third.. grr

  144. greentunic on April 19th, 2012 9:21 pm

    Is it just me or is Olivo stabbing those pitches into the ground?

  145. greentunic on April 19th, 2012 9:22 pm

    I think u put him on…

  146. Swungonandbelted on April 19th, 2012 9:23 pm

    wow… the strike zone suddenly shifted north….

  147. Ichirolling51 on April 19th, 2012 9:24 pm

    I can’t watch this.

  148. Swungonandbelted on April 19th, 2012 9:24 pm

    ………..

  149. nvn8vbryce on April 19th, 2012 9:25 pm

    Fuck.

  150. Ichirolling51 on April 19th, 2012 9:25 pm

    Double play?

  151. msfanmike on April 19th, 2012 9:25 pm

    Person of interest is on now

  152. Ichirolling51 on April 19th, 2012 9:25 pm

    fuck me side ways League sucks

  153. IwearMsHats on April 19th, 2012 9:26 pm

    Never have I seen an ump call that low strike, i think it’s only because the catcher has to drop his glove to hold on to the ball…frustrating!

  154. Ichirolling51 on April 19th, 2012 9:26 pm

    Felix is about to kill someone

  155. henryv on April 19th, 2012 9:26 pm

    Figgins with the most useless play in baseball. Doesn’t throw it within 40 feet of the plate AND allows both runners to move up.

  156. marcus_andrews on April 19th, 2012 9:26 pm

    The good news is Chris Perez is not the scariest closer ever. He’s like Joe Nathan but worse…. Searching for bright-sides here.

  157. nvn8vbryce on April 19th, 2012 9:26 pm

    Felix has got to feel snake bit just about now…

  158. juneau_fan on April 19th, 2012 9:28 pm

    That was such a cluster my feed went out.

  159. FelixFanChris420 on April 19th, 2012 9:28 pm

    We’re not allowed to have nice things…

  160. greentunic on April 19th, 2012 9:28 pm

    Figgins just needed to blow that play from both ends. Two years ago he watched the ball roll 4 feet from him like he was at a tennis match.

  161. nvn8vbryce on April 19th, 2012 9:28 pm

    Shoulda hooked him sooner, Eric, preferably before the bases were juiced.

  162. nvn8vbryce on April 19th, 2012 9:29 pm

    This game became a cluster duck in a hurry…

  163. FelixFanChris420 on April 19th, 2012 9:30 pm

    Can we somehow blame this on Miguel Olivo? I’d feel alot better if we could…

  164. terryoftacoma on April 19th, 2012 9:32 pm

    Actually Olivo made two pretty good stops back there. I’m surprised.

  165. henryv on April 19th, 2012 9:32 pm

    Can we somehow blame this on Miguel Olivo? I’d feel alot better if we could…

    Yeah, if he hadn’t grounded into an inning ending double play, the M’s would have 2 runs.

  166. greentunic on April 19th, 2012 9:33 pm

    This isn’t cricket. Throw a F*ing strike

  167. greentunic on April 19th, 2012 9:33 pm

    Hey, Hultzen had a great game at least..

  168. terryoftacoma on April 19th, 2012 9:34 pm

    Lots of pressure on a rule5..

  169. WTF_Ms on April 19th, 2012 9:39 pm

    Oh my of that was weak….

  170. henryv on April 19th, 2012 9:40 pm

    5 runs in 3 games?

    Mariner’s baseball!

  171. terryoftacoma on April 19th, 2012 9:40 pm

    Great game Felix!!! Brandon….

  172. greentunic on April 19th, 2012 9:41 pm

    Mariners are the fucking artists of mysery. They don’t just lose. They show you the’re going to win, then the lose.

  173. henryv on April 19th, 2012 9:41 pm

    Shoot, forgot the 8-9 loss.

  174. WTF_Ms on April 19th, 2012 9:41 pm

    @henryv,

    I agree…inning ending DP with a person on third….

    Olivo’s fault. Trade him or DFA him immediately.

  175. henryv on April 19th, 2012 9:42 pm

    Of at least make him sell tickets. Maybe we could attendance to 400 for tomorrow’s game.

  176. Sports on a Schtick on April 19th, 2012 9:45 pm

    That’s a top-ten loss for me right there. Awful.

  177. henryv on April 19th, 2012 9:57 pm

    Of at least make him sell tickets. Maybe we could attendance to 400 for tomorrow’s game.

    Surprisingly, I haven’t been drinking tonight. Hmmm…

  178. Westside guy on April 19th, 2012 10:28 pm

    Watched this on Tivo delay, so I ended up disappointed about 30 minutes after the rest of you. :-(

    Man, I am happy Felix loves Seattle but – I really don’t understand why.

    Also, good game for Condor after Glen and I stuck our necks out in support of him earlier in that other thread! :-D

    Olivo – not his worst game. He dropped a number of pitches, but actually blocked a few too – and I don’t remember any getting away. Maybe he’s taking pointers from Montero?

    Jaso – why are people evaluating him (as they’ve been doing with Saunders) based on a particular single at-bat? No one can hit at will. Jaso’s current line is .273/.333/.727 – I don’t expect him to maintain that, but it’s hard to find fault with his offensive performance right now!

  179. hidalgo on April 19th, 2012 10:43 pm

    The loss in this game should go to Wedge. You play the infield at normal depth in the ninth. Best case Hannahan’s grounder is a DP. Worst case we’re still playing. Shoulda been a sweep. This series was basically Mariners vs Mariners.

  180. marinerbullpen on April 19th, 2012 11:10 pm

    Blaming Wedge is wrong. Might not agree with all his lineup decisions, but which team doesn’t have some poor lineup decisions?

    We, have no clue what actually goes on in the clubhouse, that includes you!

    Playoffs, this year. NO.

    I still love my M’s.

  181. Westside guy on April 19th, 2012 11:16 pm

    Yeah… this game, I gotta give the loss to the guys being unable to put many hits together. It looked disturbingly like a lot of Felix’s losses during his Cy Young year.

  182. JoshJones on April 20th, 2012 9:09 am

    Dave,
    You’ve been the one driving the bus on getting Olivo out of town. And since you started to point out why last season you have made me a believer in your concept that Olivo is best served as a backup C at best. However, your critique of Wedge couldn’t be any more wrong.
    He can’t just go bashing Olivo in front of everyone. Hell maybe he’s even smarter than you realize and he’s just trying to get a hot streak out of Olivo so he can get someone to eat his contract or just release him …just like were hopefully doing with Figgy.
    Also, your comment that Managers don’t really matter much is just absurd. Your ability to manage statistics is fantastic. But my money is on you being an atrocious coach.

  183. FelixFanChris420 on April 20th, 2012 10:31 am

    JoshJones, actually its not. Wedge’s in game decisions are pretty awful as well. Someone tell that man that its legal to pinch hit!

  184. IdahoInvader on April 20th, 2012 10:48 am

    I have a front row seat on that olivo-out-bus.

    Wedge doesn’t have to criticize him, he just needs to NOT PLAY him.

    Hey, he’s fine w/ letting Jaso and others rot on the bench, so we know benching isn’t against his philosophy.

  185. stevemotivateir on April 20th, 2012 11:06 am

    @josh

    Managing 101: Put the best team you can on the field. It’s not complicated. Look at the match-ups, career numbers, play the odds.

    @idaho

    I’ll drive that bus!

  186. IdahoInvader on April 20th, 2012 12:48 pm

    LOL

    I wasn’t wild about seeing Figgy in LF w/ a one run lead in the last inning. Surely that situation cries out for a defensive replacement. Granted, that would require actually “managing.” Wells probably has twice the arm as the Figlet & his middle infielder pop gun.

  187. JoshJones on April 20th, 2012 1:21 pm

    Alrighty then, consider this.

    Perhaps Wedge is running Figgins and Olivo out there to “hopefully” increase their trade value. Im convinced that’s what they are doing with figgins. Taking him out for a defensive substitution makes him look bad.

    I think wedge is sticking with the veterans. He’s trying to get them to play to his percieved potential. As long as it ends up with him giving them the backseat as the season goes along then i’m all for it. Perhaps it’s theraputic for Wedge to see Olivo for what he is…a shitty offensive/defensive catcher.

    @stevemotivatier

    Managing ISN’T that simple. I’ve been doing it for over 10 years now. If it was as simple as matchups/career numbers/playing the odds then Chone Figgins wouldn’t be batting leadoff. There’s confidence factors, team concepts, egos etc.

  188. stevemotivateir on April 20th, 2012 1:47 pm

    ^First, everyone knows what the plan with Figgins is. But there really isn’t an argument for Olivo because he isn’t expensive and he’s on the wrong side of 30. His numbers are rapidly declining. Trade value shouldn’t be the deciding factor on whether he plays.

    Second, I didn’t say managing was simple, I said it’s not complicated (yes, there’s a difference) -and I’m referring to the basic principles, hence the “101″ reference. I’m backing up Dave, because I agree, that who’s managing shouldn’t make that big of a difference. Key word: shouldn’t. The fundamentals, the most basic, general rules/ideas/principles ARE the same -no matter who’s in charge.

  189. JoshJones on April 20th, 2012 1:53 pm

    ^I love john jaso. He should be starting 4/5 games a week with Montero taking the other start. But we all know that isn’t going to happen.

    So we either trade/release olivo. Or make him the 3rd string catcher. For some reason i dont ever see that happening. Olivo is a very well liked guy in that club house. He’s a coaches player type of guy for whatever reason (he can’t field or hit).

    So what is wedge supposed to do? Put him on the bench. Like it or not that could create a problem in the clubhouse.

    I can only hope Wedge is playing Olivo hoping he either improves or is so bad they trade or release him. If he is truly playing him because he thinks he is best suited for the starting role then he’s making a mistake.

  190. stevemotivateir on April 20th, 2012 2:08 pm

    ^I agree with ya on those points, but the one thing I’d mention, is that these are professional players… they (should) all know, that being liked and performing -have to go together. Otherwise, performing alone takes the cake. What’s best for the team should be the priority. Everyone wants to play, but it should be understood when/why the player performing better gets the starts.

  191. stevemotivateir on April 20th, 2012 2:13 pm

    Another point I was trying to make, is that it isn’t important to worry about getting something from Olivo. He isn’t costing that much, and even if he hit .250, he wont bring in much of a return (probably nothing), so there’s little reason to keep him around. I don’t think DFA’n him would hurt the morale in the clubhouse either. I think the show of confidence in Jaso and Montero (who also seem to be well-liked), will benefit the team.

  192. JoshJones on April 20th, 2012 2:16 pm

    ^Oh sure. In a perfect world. Maybe even 5 years ago. But pro sports are filled with pre-madonas. Most are underworked and over paid. Twitter, facebook, social media. The 15 man on a NBA roster can demand a trade, etc. At all levels of sport their is one things that cant be dissected or fully understood and that’s the ego/psyche of a ballplayer.

    Figgins insisting to be a leadoff hitter is a perfect example.

    I’m all for DFA’ing Olivo. I think we should have done that before the season started. but we didn’t so now Wedge i’m assuming Wedge is stuck juggling that situation without pissing anyone off.

  193. FelixFanChris420 on April 20th, 2012 2:47 pm

    His job isnt to “not piss anyone off”, his job is to put the team in the best position to win baseball games. That’s starts with playing your best players and not playing your worst playrs except when necessary. Not only does playing Olivo not result in furthering either of those goals, it actualy actively retards progress. Those are the simple facts and anything about egos and being a veteran or pissing him off is inconsequential (or should be).

  194. stevemotivateir on April 20th, 2012 2:58 pm

    @josh

    You really think it’s that complicated? They’re grown men, they’re professionals, and they’re MARINERS! If it was that complicated, they’d hire pyschiatrists and therapists instead of managers.

  195. JoshJones on April 20th, 2012 3:03 pm

    ^I totally disagree. A manager can’t go into a clubhouse and start throwing chairs and turning everyday players into backup-to-the-backup roles.

    Look at Bobby Valentine. He went into Boston and thought he could just change everything and call players out. BobbyV calls out Youk..Youk gets offended…Pedroia takes Youks side. Now you have clubhouse drama.

    Or how the Lakers handled the Lamar Odom situation. They almost traded Lamar and that pissed Lamar off. As a result, he demanded to be traded. So they traded him to Dallas. As a result, Kobe bryant was pissed off.

    Doing things to drastically can create major problems. What if Felix and Olivo are best friends and it makes Felix demand a trade. Probablly not going to happen..But who knows. Players now days are spoiled. Everyone is assuming its as simple as just don’t play Olivo. All i’m saying is it’s not that simple and I wouldn’t be suprised if there were extentuating circumstances.

  196. Westside guy on April 20th, 2012 3:30 pm

    You really think it’s that complicated? They’re grown men, they’re professionals, and they’re MARINERS! If it was that complicated, they’d hire pyschiatrists and therapists instead of managers.

    Some of these guys qualify as grown men. A number of them, though, are basically spoiled teenagers who’ve never had to deal with reality because they’ve always had people padding the sharp corners of the world for them just due to their ability to play a children’s game very, very well.

  197. stevemotivateir on April 20th, 2012 3:39 pm

    Motivational speeches are one thing, pyschiatric conditioning is another!

  198. stevemotivateir on April 20th, 2012 3:46 pm

    My point is still the same… I’m not arguing whether or not it’s simple to manage a team, I’m saying that the fundamentals of managing, the basic principles ARE the same, no matter the manager. One thing all managers have to do, is improvise. And, again, we’re talking about the Mariners.

  199. stevemotivateir on April 20th, 2012 4:22 pm

    I understand (and agree with) what you said Westy. But handling different personalities, dealing with what you might call maturity issues, isn’t something a manager can’t handle. Shouldn’t be anyway. Veterans play a role in situations like that. By the time a player makes it to the MLB level, there should already be a pretty good understanding (with most players) of what is needed and expected of them.

    I seriously doubt the situation with Olivo has anything to do with fear of clubhouse resentment if he’s benched or removed. I think it’s pure stubbornness on Wedge’s part.

Leave a Reply

You must be logged in to post a comment.