Game 75, Athletics at Mariners
Erasmo Ramirez vs. Tom Milone, 7:10pm
The A’s have cycled through six first-basemen so far this season. Due to a combination of injuries and an almost pathological need to make minor transactions, the A’s have used 20 pitchers and four catchers (and people thought the M’s carrying three was insane). They have acquired, willingly, Brandon Inge. They have essentially taken the Pacific Coast League all-stars of recent years and given them a few weeks to see what they could do at the big league level. Brandon Allen? Nope. Kila Ka’aihue? Nah. Collin Cowgill? Ehhh, not awful, I guess. How about Michael Taylor? The A’s are so ecumenical that they’re now starting 2003 Futures Game player Travis Blackley (as an aside, I’m thrilled for Blackley). This isn’t a typical rebuilding job – these guys aren’t exactly young, and none of them are really heralded. It’s also not surprising; the A’s acquired many of these guys in various deals this past off-season. All of this suggested a team that was a step behind the M’s, whose wholesale rebuilding job brought in name-brand prospects and whose starting rotation, while admittedly jury-rigged, included a mix of veterans and a few interesting young kids. The A’s starting 3B in April was an average hitter in the PCL last year, and he was mostly a catcher. Few things can make you feel a tiny bit better about being a fan of the team employing Chone Figgins, and I’m not even sure the Josh Donaldson experiment qualifies, though his sub-.400 OPS helps.
The M’s begin this series 4.5 games behind Oakland, and the A’s come in having won 7 of their last 10. The A’s soft-tossing lefty out of USC is Tom Milone, who came over in the Gio Gonzalez trade. The M’s tried a soft-tossing lefty out of USC last year, and that didn’t go so well. In the past decade, every M’s fan has grumbled about how everything seems to work out for the Angels – that even their jaw-dropping mistakes don’t sink the team, or the way they always beat their pythag winning percentage. I’ve developed that sort of feeling about the 2012 Athletics. They shouldn’t be better than the M’s. You can make a good case that the A’s themselves weren’t TRYING to be better than this year’s M’s. But here we are.
Let’s watch a baseball game!
1: Ichiro (RF)
2: Gutierrez (CF)
3: Seager (3B)
4: Montero (DH)
5: Smoak (1B)
6: Saunders (LF)
7: Olivo (C)
8: Ackley (2B)
9: Ryan (SS)
SP: Erasmo!
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122 Responses to “Game 75, Athletics at Mariners”
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Since the A’s rebuilt what seemed like 2/3 of their roster during the offseason, I was sure this was the year that the Mariners would not finish last in the West. After the Mariners handled them earlier this season, I felt even more certain of it
I am less certain now.
And yes, it is still surprising.
I keep holding out for Pujols’ contract sinking the Angels in 5 years. But somehow I get the feeling theyll be just fine.
That the As seem to have good fortune as well makes me very pouty. This isnt even to mention the AL champion rangers.
I’m feeling kind of uneasy about this game. Our lineup isnt great against lefties anyway, and having to hope for mistakes so that Olivo doesn’t strike out four times isn’t encouraging. Hopefully Saunders can continue his run against lefties… but wouldn’t it be a good night to see Wells in right?
Mariners hitters have been worth 8.6 WAR (88wRC+)
Athletics hitters have been worh 8.2 WAR (88wRC+)
Speaking of WAR stats, is there a good place to find individual player offensive and defensive WAR stats? I can find the aggregate WAR stat for all players – obviously, but not the individual breakout. And no, I have not looked very hard. Just wondering the quickest route and I knew someone here would know. Thanks.
Yeah Westy – I was rooting for Montero to start at catcher with Wells at DH, but am not surprised he is not in the lineup today. I swear, if Wells k’s a couple times, he sits for three games. He is a rhythm player and needs reps. Certainly more than Olivo needing them.
Oh well …..,,,
Mike, you might find those WAR stats at the espn site. Westy turned me on to that site not too long ago. Really surprised me, in a good way!
Wedge is officially an idiot. I’m sure there’s a more appropriate label for a manager who addicts himself to pre-conceived notions in spite of inconsistencies and results, not to mention common sense, but for now, ” idiot” seems as good as any.
Three lefties vs. a LHP at the expense of a hot-hitting Wells, and a pathetic receiver. Granted, you’d have to have a little imagination to sit Ichiro or Saunders, or a little backbone.
Unless Chuck Armstrong is dictating certain aspects of this, Wedge is a dolt.
Ackley, for crying out loud (on a 120 K pace)? Seager? Good hitter but slumping a bit. This has ” bats shoved up our rump” written all over it.
The worst possible lineup he could ever trot out against a decent left handed starter. We’ll see.
Agreed, Mike – and if Wells is getting sat down for the strikeouts, shouldn’t Olivo’s butt be permanently nailed to the bench?
I don’t really have a problem with Olivo catching today – it’s just that Wedge’s choices seem so… arbitrary.
Guti continues to hit!
VC, I’m curious about your Ackley comment. Are you saying Ackley should be sitting? I dunno, although the local sports radio hosts are starting to question his future…. what do people think about Ack’s struggles?
So good having Guti back.
Way to go, Coco Puffs!
Wow, that Seattle sun must have really got the best of him.
Actually, being from California – he hasn’t adjusted to the low light levels up here yet.
Move in the “Batters-eye”
Wow, hit me harder!!
The bad Ramirez is back.
What was that about “bad” Ramirez? hehe
It looks like, once again, OTHER teams have no problems with Safeco’s fences!
I would have used Wells instead of Saunders and Figgins instead of Ackley. And I would have dropped Seager in the order. Perhaps led off with Figgins. Drastic, yes, but not as drastic as what’s out there tonight. A manager should manage. Otherwise, just trot the same nine out there eight out of ten days. None of them are that reliable.
I gotta disagree with that. Saunders should play pretty much every day.
Ackley!
Interestingly enough (and somewhat surprisingly too) Ackleys walk and strikeout rates are almost a mirror image of last season. His weak September obviously skewing things, but so far – a direct match to last season. And, yuck!
His BABIP is down from last year, but that is direct reflection of Barrell issues, unrelated to luck IMO.
Vetted: I think your first post had some really good points within it. I was wondering though, how do you really feel?
Bench Saunders? I’d rather have Saunders out there than Wells. Well’s DH’n would make more sense, with Montero catching (Olivo left out), as Westy suggested earlier.
I hope that Ackley comes around, but how many times does Blowers get to say, “Maybe this will be the one that brings him around”?
Also, Casper Wells is easily as good an outfielder as Mike Saunders, and his overall MLB hitting numbers are better. He deserves the same opportunities as Saunders. He’s clearly not going to get them.
Yeah, Saunders has hit lefties well, this year. No reason for the best athlete on the team to sit. Olivo should be the one sitting
Figgins over Ackley: I gotta disagree with that one.
ESPN Site … Thanks Steve
I’d like to see more of Wells, but not at the expense of Saunders, and I’m not about to call him an equal defensively, or with the bat.
Thank Westy, Mike! I wouldn’t have known about it otherwise!
and Ichiro gets an Ichiro hit!
Worth noting, I love that we’re having conversations about real outfielders! Nice change, from the complaints/concerns with Carp, Liddi, and Figgins.
I am firmly committed to not complaining about Smoak for at least another half inning. If I were to complain, I could some up his troubles in 4 words:
No aluminum bats allowed
Let’s hear it for the Oakland defense!
Smoak lucked into an error….he is almost a certain out each AB. He either needs to go, or go down and figure things out.
Ozzie Smith would have caught that flair in his back pocket. Good thing he’s not playing today.
Oh crap….batting order kills us again…Olivo, another sure out…or maybe GIDP.
Wow…I typed that, and it happened, in one pitch.
Wow, I can’t believe it… Olivo didn’t K.
It will look like a line drive in the box score Mr. Saunders.
Hey Miggy, go fu …
Oh piss on it. Never mind. I am running out of reasons to beat that dead horse.
Wedge, good decision. Thank you!
Going back a little bit, but Vetted I pretty much disagree with every one of your points. There is no reason Figgins should be playing over Ackley. Statistically it doesn’t really make sense (admittedly Ackley has been bad but Figgins is horrible both offensively and defensively regardless of handedness or position).
To say this is the worst lineup we can put out there is asinine. If you just look at primary positions of every player on the bench you’ll see that each sub would probably make us worse. Kawasaki for Ryan, worse. Figgins for Seager (or as you suggested Ackley), worse. Jaso for Olivo, worse. Now I know that this is something that may catch everyone off guard but Jaso is AWFUL against lefties on the whole and Olivo strives against soft throwing lefties. I hate him as much (probably more than) the next guy but IF you’re going to play him, this is exactly the day to do it. Wells for Saunders, arguable but probably worse overal.
In short I think you want Wedge to do something because doing nothing isn’t working, but that’s no more of a legitimate strategy than hoping that players who seem bound to improve, will (Ackley in particular). This lineup might have a few slight questions, but it’s really not nearly as bad of a lineup as many that have been run up there and I really don’t think it’s questionable in hardly any way.
Just remember he won’t be here next year Mike.
Vetted, do you think Ramirez misses up because of lack of follow through or because he tries to overthrow a bit to increase velo? I see both from time to time. What say you?
Ozzie has lost a step. He might not have gotten that.
Luis Rodriguez, while not an exciting part of any future, should be starting today (and in the majors, of course.)
He tends to over throw at times instead of pitch. IMO
Good point book book. I had forgotten that Ozzie is pushing 60.
In spite of Blowers and Sims going on and on about Kurt Suzuki, he will be splitting time with Derek Norris behind the plate. According to BB.
Thanks Terry. I agree. I think it would help him (especially his change up) if he followed through more completely. He tends to block himself from following through on some pitches.
Yep, out front and open. Not letting ball travel deep enough. Instead of having him watch tape of himself, have him watch some tape of Edgar (mirror image if necessary), instead.
I’ve been watching Ackley closely(who hasn’t) for a couple of weeks now and it’s appears to me that he’s almost checking his swing on a lot of pitches. I don’t how to describe it better. Lack of follow through or something. Maybe, he’s undecided whether swing until the last moment. But the sting isn’t there anymore that was there when he first came up.
So, another Miggy annoyance. Does he drop EVERY third strike, and have to tag??? I’m still stunned that his position is “catcher”, and yet he can’t “catch” the ball…OK, I’m done complaining too, al la Mike.
I steadfastly refuse to worry about Ackley yet. I agree he needs some work though. What’s Josh Bard’s brother up to?
I agree too Westy. I’m not sweating Ackley just yet. He’s young and has some work and adjustments to make. It’s the old “veterans” that are hanging around for no obvious reason that pisses me off. Also the “tool” guys that have NOT lived up to the billing…I think you know who I mean.
Yeah I know, WTF… quit ragging on Seager!!
/kidding
Dear Jesus,
The reason they keep throwing a ball in the dirt outside to you with two strikes is that you keep swinging at it and missing.
So with two strikes, as a catcher, what would you throw to you?
That’s an interesting point, Breadbaker. All things being equal, you’d expect catchers to make better hitters.
Erasmo! The little guy is bringing it!
Interesting pitch selection on that one. Good Job.
In the meantime, a guy with a road ERA of 7.00 is white-washing the Mariners, who are working on their 9th shutout in half a season. They haven’t scored in 20 innings, and stretches like this have been common for half a decade. This is not an MLB offense. And it doesn’t change. The Mariners defy Bill James’ theory of competitive balance, which is based on numbers that have been dependable across the board for decades.
It’s not about Ackley, or Ichiro, or Smoak. It’s about an organization that doesn’t get it done offensively. The Pirates are better. The Orioles are better. The Indians, Mets, Nationals. Better, better, better.
We’re not better.
So far, nothing much has really changed.
Generate a leg run, Saundy
They know they don’t have to throw much to Condor, what with Olivo up next.
Swing, dummy!!!!!!!!
Yeah, they did give him something to hit after all.
Hey Miguel! Good job!
Oh Ackley, why did you swing at THAT?
Wow, Ack needs help. He is going to see down and away pitches until he makes the adjustment. Every pitcher knows that’s the safe place to pitch him.
I think the offensive woes might be tied into the scent of garlic fries. Is there any proof against it?
Very worried about Ackley. At least he hasn’t been terrible, but he’s been relentlessly mediocre.
Okay, maybe I’m drunk in a bar in idaho, but seriously… What the funke.
7 hits no runs.
Bring in the fences and make them out of garlic fries.
Nicely done Ramirez, unfortunately you had to do it for this team…bunch of no-run-support giving bastards….
This offense needs more than a hit an inning to score so… no score.
Mmm… garlic fries…
Have a shot of fireball whiskey and don’t worry about it, Henry.
It is groundhog day/night at Safeco.
Jaso sighting! Soon to be followed by a Mascot sighting!
Runs runs runs runs runs!
A called K during pinch hitting duty: almost nothing pisses off a Manager more than that.
ARGH.
It looks like yesterday’s shutout was merely a warmup for today’s shutout.
Be patient, though … Patience is the key, Mariner fans. The Plan is in place.
Seager hit. Montero K. Smoak DP
I have seen the future.
Have you heard of any of these guys that are currently kicking our teams ass? Any of them??
ouch….
Hey Mike, Westy is Westy-Damus, remember? I like his predictions more…
Mike, I think the old crystal ball might need a bit of polishing.
Edit: Seager K. Montero hit. Smoak DP
I have no idea what the future holds.
That was dumb, Westy.
Safeco is tough on umps, apparently. That does not look good.
I still think Smoak is going to hit into a DP.
COME ON CONDOR.
Hehe Mike.
Note to self: buy a new crystal ball.
Don’t be an idiot, Figgy.
Come on Saunders – end this shitcapade.
… In a good way
If Saunders hits a home run, I swear I will buy everyone a beer at the USSM/LL event.
The game will end not with a bang, but with a whimper.
You’re safe. No beers to buy.
These guys are the suckiest bunch of sucks that ever sucked /shakes fist at TV………
From Brazil, Steve?
I am stupid enough to wake up tomorrow and be looking forward to the next game. Yes, I am. Who’s with me?!
Save your dough and buy a bigger TV so you can see the Suckiners sucking it up… or not!
I am Mike!
Not sure what that says about either one of us, though. Gluttons for punishment?
Haha, we had a set-back. Not leaving til at least the 22nd now, so I got a pair of tickets. Hopefully not much later than the 22nd.
Uh, I wont wake up with you, Mike. But it sounds like Westy’s game.
Oh, but I do look forward to the next game, anyway.
Much more of this and I am going to need beer from Papua New Guinea.
Speaking of gluttony… I wonder how the post-game spread is after a loss…
I look forward to tomorrow…
Pathetic offense.
I think we just love baseball. And stats. Nothing wrong with that. Pretty easy life, actually ,,, but I could sure do with less suckiness on the playing field.
It’s frustrating to Keep watching a team of ass.
Really curious what happens before the deadline. I say that every year, but after games like this, it’s nice to have something to look forward to, that MIGHT impact the future positively.
Agreed, Steve. Problem is, the players I want to see go away probably won’t.
Olivo is still sucking, Figgins never stopped sucking, League has been mediocre at best…
BTW given that Olivo has done ZILCH to increase his value since coming off the DL – why are we still seeing him so much?!
Yeah, and if Olivo was going to be traded, it likely would have happened by now. Unless a freak accident or injury occurs, I can’t imagine anyone taking a flyer on him.
Mariners acquire–Carlos Gonzalez, Chad Bettis
Rockies acquire–Felix Hernandez, James Paxton, Nick Franklin, Marcio Robles.
Who has a problem with this trade? We still have Hultzen and Paxton, with Bettis added to provide more depth. Carlos Gonzalez is the exact kind of hitter we need to build around, and this is the kind of deal we can actually *talk* about maybe parting with Felix. With the Rockies absolutely horrendous pitching, throwing in a couple other prospects including Paxton? You’re telling me they wouldn’t think about it?
I’m so confused this season… So does Ichiro suck now, or not?
He leads the team in Batting AVG (excepting Guty, but “small sample size” there), 3rd in dbles, 1st in triples… 2nd in steals… His defense is still above average.
He hit .391 over the past 10 days…
Ichiro, much like our entire team’s road success at hitting dingers and scoring runs (2nd and 4th in all of baseball), is totally not fitting into the fan induced stereotypes.
The screwy dilemma of the moment:
Our pitchers can’t pitch on the road
Our hitters can’t hit at home
Our pitchers are brilliant at Safeco
Our hitters are pretty damn good everywhere else…
Fix this, Jack Z!
You might want to check Gonzalez’s Coors/Away splits before you make that trade. Away from Coors his 2012 OPS has been .806 – in 2011 it was .757.
So yeah – I have a problem with that trade. Seems to me you’re trading Felix and three other guys for Kyle Seager.
Kyle-
(raising my hand)
Um, I have a problem with that trade… For many reasons…
Not even considering how rare it is for two teams to trade their absolute fan favorite, mega star players to each other. That just doesn’t happen.
What the hell Kyle?
I wouldn’t even trade Felix for CarGo straight up let alone throwing in our #4 and #5 prospects, are you dreaming or something?
I’m not even sure I’d trade Cargo for Paxton and Franklin straight up, crikey.
Maybe I oversold a bit (okay a lot), I admit that. But come on. Carlos Gonzalez is the exact kind of player we need to talk about, and the situation in Colorado is one that we can actually get a star-level hitter via trade, using our organizational strength of pitching to entice them into it. His away spits are .276/.329/.476/.809. Which would instantly make him the best hitter on the Mariners even if those numbers held at that level.
I don’t know what players we could use, but this is something we should talk about. The Mariners offense is putrid. Is no one else sick of watching low scoring 1 run losses year in, year out?
Maybe I oversold a bit (okay a lot), I admit that. But come on. Carlos Gonzalez is the exact kind of player we need to talk about, and the situation in Colorado is one that we can actually get a star-level hitter via trade, using our organizational strength of pitching to entice them into it. His away spits are .276/.329/.476/.809. Which would instantly make him the best hitter on the Mariners even if those numbers held at that level.
I don’t know what players we could use, but this is something we should talk about. The Mariners offense is putrid. Is no one else sick of watching low scoring 1 run losses year in, year out?
Maybe I oversold a bit (okay a lot), I admit that. But come on. Carlos Gonzalez is the exact kind of player we need to talk about, and the situation in Colorado is one that we can actually get a star-level hitter via trade, using our organizational strength of pitching to entice them into it. His away spits are .276/.329/.476/.809. Which would instantly make him the best hitter on the Mariners even if those numbers held at that level.
I don’t know what players we could use, but this is something we should talk about. The Mariners offense is putrid. Is no one else sick of watching low scoring 1 run losses year in, year out?
Players consistently outperform their road ops when they leave Coors.
Kyle, I’m not opposed to getting a guy like CarGo – I just wouldn’t trade Felix for him. I admit to resorting to a bit of hyperbole in my response though.
I agree with you… our offense is terrible. On just about every other team, a guy hitting .270-ish would be a “decent piece” – NOT the “team’s best hitter”!
Westy said:
“I agree with you… our offense is terrible. On just about every other team, a guy hitting .270-ish would be a “decent piece” – NOT the “team’s best hitter”!”
I agree with Westy, hence my semi tongue-in-cheek Ichiro comments above, where we fret about his decline while he leads the Mariners in batting with a .278 avg. (DEFINITELY a decline- but better than anybody else currently on the team)
Westy already mentioned the Home vs. Road splits for Carlos Gonzales (and they are somewhat dramatic), so there is no reason to reinforce that point. There is also no way to know if ‘he’ would increase his away OPS once ‘he’ left Coors Field, but granted – the facts are the facts for other players who did leave. Thanks for that info bookbook.
2012 WAR to date:
Carlos Gonzalez 2.2
Ichiro Suzuki 2.1
Peekay ^^ seemed to capture the essence of the moment, pretty well.
You don’t trade a Felix Hernandez, a Cy Young winner, for a hitter that averages around .270 outside of a hitter-friendly park. IF you’re going to trade him for someone, you do it for a well-established, .300+ hitter with 100+ RBI production… and then some. Felix is a proven ace. There’s no reason you can’t ask for an elite hitter in return.
Having said that, I really like Gonzalez, and I’d love to see him here for a much smaller return.