Game 37, A’s at Mariners

Dave · May 11, 2013 at 3:32 pm · Filed Under Mariners 

Maurer vs Parker, 6:10 pm.

And now we get to the part of the rotation that is why the Mariners are not a good team. The gulf between Hernandez/Iwakuma and Maurer/Saunders/Harang is just so vast. Maurer is in for a bit of a test tonight, as the A’s can load their line-up with LHBs, who have owned him so far this year. With six left-handed hitters, and the right-handed bats including Yoenis Cespedes, this is a pretty good test to see if Maurer’s change-up is making any progress. If it’s all sliders all the time tonight, expect Oakland to put up crooked numbers early.

And the disaster OF defense makes another return, since Raul hit a home run last night and Major League managers absolutely are bound by yesterday’s performance when setting the line-up. Good thing Maurer’s not a contact pitcher who relies on his defe… oh.

1. Saunders, CF
2. Seager, 3B
3. Morales, DH
4. Morse, RF
5. Smoak, 1B
6. Ibanez, LF
7. Ackley, 2B
8. Shoppach, C
9. Ryan, SS

Comments

113 Responses to “Game 37, A’s at Mariners”

  1. Paul B on May 11th, 2013 3:57 pm

    Sigh.

  2. Westside guy on May 11th, 2013 4:03 pm

    I think I may DVR this one and start watching it late. If the game gets out of hand early, I don’t have to waste a bunch of time finding it out… but if Maurer comes through, I’ll still get to see it.

    Re: Raul – given the roster they’ve constructed, I’ve resigned myself to the fact we’re going to see this line-up fairly frequently. But it’s just another reminder of why I am now actively rooting for Z to be fired. He’s a one trick pony. He’ll make a good farm system manager or amateur scouting director for some other team, but he’s got no business sitting in the GM’s seat.

  3. Paul B on May 11th, 2013 4:21 pm

    Last night notwithstanding, Raul’s role should be the grizzled veteran on the bench who occasionally pinch hits.

    Which this team doesn’t really need.

    I’m still not convinced that Bay has rediscovered 2009, an fear he’ll revert to the 2011-2012 version.

    I’ve given up on Smoak.

    I still have hopes for Montero, given his age and flashes of ability hitting.

    Ackley, even hitting as poorly as he is, isn’t this team’s worst problem. He’s middle of the road as a second baseman (9th out of 12 in AL WAR for full time second basemen).

    Morse, if he can stay healthy, and if the Mariners can sign him up for a couple more years, then the trade for him will turn out to be decent. Two big ifs, though.

    And the pitching staff… Kuma is saving this team’s butt so far this season.

  4. MrZDevotee on May 11th, 2013 4:40 pm

    We’re all so resigned to the fact that Guty hardly ever plays baseball that it’s easy to overlook just how much of a problem he has been for this team. For a couple years now.

    This lineup is flawed no doubt. But Guty is a huge part of that. A healthy Guty and Bay and Ibanez are the bench bats. And the OF is pretty strong.

    But the entire outfield AND the batting order goes out of whack when we believe he’ll contribute and then he doesn’t.

    No excuses for NOT being prepared as an organization to deal with it, especially this many years into his fraility… But I’d think an OF of Saunders, Guty and Morse… And a lineup that featured:

    Saunders
    Guty
    Morales
    Morse
    Smoak
    Seager
    Shoppach
    Ackley
    Ryan

    Would almost count as a “contending” ball club, in a wild card hunt (with a deeper rotation, naturally).

    But the simple deletion of Guty from all of the above moves everyone else out of position, and forces weak bats and gloves into everyday roles, and thins the bench, and limits moves late in games, and squeezes “pitch-to-contact” pitchers into trying to miss bats, etc, etc.

    Sigh.

  5. Paul B on May 11th, 2013 4:42 pm

    MrZ, I’d dump Smoak, and move Morse to DH, and try to find another outfielder. Thames, if no one else. With Endy as a defensive sub.

  6. MrZDevotee on May 11th, 2013 5:12 pm

    Paul-
    No doubt… Plenty of improvements to be made even with him, but it just feels so much more “adequate” with a healthy Guty involved.

  7. Paul B on May 11th, 2013 5:13 pm

    Oh, yeah, I was saying in addition to that.

  8. Kazinski on May 11th, 2013 5:54 pm

    I can’t see Thames being anything but a wash with Smoak offensively, and he doesn’t have the defensive chops to make the move worthwhile.

    Anyway, Smoak has earned some more time to figure it out, he’s put up 30 days of above league average offense now, even though his slugging percentage hasn’t shown much of a bump. His line last 30 days actually looks pretty good:

    .272/.379/.383 122 wRC+

    He needs to show more power of course, but what we’ve seen so far from Smoak in being patient is very encouraging. It just doesn’t make any sense do get rid of Smoak until we have signed Morse and Morales for next year at least. I am pretty sure Smoak still has options, but there is no reason to send him down right now either.

    It would make much more sense to get rid of Raul than Smoak, then carry 4 outfielders, call up Triunfel and see if he can play short in the majors. But its hard to do that unless because we would have to DFA Andino.

  9. miscreant on May 11th, 2013 5:54 pm

    I kind of wish the M’s had signed Lohse. But then they would have lost that precious 1st round draft pick whom we may or may not see produce in the Majors several years down the road. Jack Z loves him some draft picks.

    As for outfielders…As we watched quality free agent outfielders sign with other teams I wondered what would happen when (not if)Gutierrez got hurt. This is the result, Ibanez and Bay playing way too much.

    hindsight is 20/20 of course

  10. Paul B on May 11th, 2013 6:03 pm

    Smoak’s offensive value has been almost totally due to walks this year.

    That’s nice, but if he is going to have a major league career he will have to hit more line drives.

  11. Paul B on May 11th, 2013 6:07 pm

    It isn’t hindsight if we were all saying it in January.

  12. Kazinski on May 11th, 2013 6:30 pm

    I don’t think Bay is playing too much. He is actually been playing pretty well. His defense has been adequate, and he is producing offensively with a decent OBP.

  13. HighlightsAt11 on May 11th, 2013 6:31 pm

    I’m know I’m behind… it’s good Maurer no-hitter went away in the first. Now he can settle down.

  14. HighlightsAt11 on May 11th, 2013 6:32 pm

    Then gives up a home run in the second.

  15. HighlightsAt11 on May 11th, 2013 6:34 pm

    Agreed…Ibanez’s home run yesterday not withstanding, Bay has done much more to deserve a spot in the lineup.

  16. Paul B on May 11th, 2013 6:39 pm

    Ackley had Jaso played just right.

  17. stevemotivateir on May 11th, 2013 6:41 pm

    Yeah, no kidding Paul. And that’s really good, because that inning could have gotten ugly real quick!

  18. stevemotivateir on May 11th, 2013 6:42 pm

    Regarding Bay…. he’s been great against RHP. Chavez has been great against LHP. Ibanez has been inconsistent and a liability in the field.

    So of course, we see more of Ibanez.

  19. HighlightsAt11 on May 11th, 2013 6:43 pm

    Maurer has thrown two straight balls to start off EVERY batter this inning. Glad the two walks came after the home run.

    I don’t understand how the M’s got into such a rotation predicament and having to bring Maurer up in hurry. He’s still developing and should be doing that in Tacoma.

    The bottom 3/5th’s of the rotation earns an F. And Z does too for allowing that to happen, pretending everything is such great shape on the farm. But clearly the farm is not so well developed in too many positions. So how does that help the current parent club?

  20. Kazinski on May 11th, 2013 6:52 pm

    I know this is a low bar to clear, and small sample size, etc. But Jason Bay is currently the best offensive LF the Mariners have had in the last 10 years.

    And I would still rather have kept Casper. He was 5th on the list in 400+ PA.

  21. HighlightsAt11 on May 11th, 2013 6:57 pm

    This game could turn on who makes the first mistake….uhh nevermind, the A’s have already capitalized on the M’s mistake in the second inning. But the first mistake was inserting Ibanez in the lineup.

  22. stevemotivateir on May 11th, 2013 6:57 pm

    The plan and handling of the rotation was certainly frustrating, but the other moves and non-moves STILL aggravate me.

    Watching Bourn and Swisher playing great for Cleveland, while we get a combo of Morse (eh, defensive rant), Bay, or Ibanez on most nights, really sucks. And the fact that we really don’t have anyone near ready in the system to replace any of them, makes it suck even more, though I suppose we could get lucky with Romero. The 2014 FA crop of outfielders isn’t very enticing, so there’s another strike.

    Imagine what this offense would be like with Swisher, Bourn, and Jaso.

    Back to reality, I really hope Ramirez and Hultzen heal fast and well, and are able to contribute at some point this season (if they’re ready). Hopeful we’ll land at least one decent outfielder we can hold on to for a while as well, though I worry about the price Jack might pay.

  23. Paul B on May 11th, 2013 7:05 pm

    That changeup wasn’t improved.

  24. HighlightsAt11 on May 11th, 2013 7:16 pm

    Yes the situation in the outfield is as bad as the pitching rotation bottom +half.

    With the current lineup I don’t expect the M’s will be toying with the .500 mark for very long. Not with the schedule ahead of them.

    A major difficulty is, as the trade ‘deadline’ approaches, the M’s do not have any players on the roster who are playing well, who the M’s could use as trade bait. The few who are, are untouchable (esp. King, Kuma, Seager, MSaunders). I don’t expect Morse or Morales will be contributing as much as they did the first half April. Ackley appeared to be getting it together, but that is no longer happening.

  25. HighlightsAt11 on May 11th, 2013 7:16 pm

    Saunders is about the only one who can steal a base for the M’s and he gets picked off.

  26. Paul B on May 11th, 2013 7:18 pm

    I’d vote for Seager for the all star team.

  27. SonOfZavaras on May 11th, 2013 7:29 pm

    Considering the sheer dearth of quality in American League third basemen, Seager IMO has a shot.

  28. SonOfZavaras on May 11th, 2013 7:32 pm

    I’m wondering if Maurer can develop a split as a “show-me” pitch early in counts…and against lefties.

    Only problem is, a split usually ISN’T a strike. If they don’t offer…

    Still, at 6’5″ he probably has the hands to have a split.

  29. SonOfZavaras on May 11th, 2013 7:36 pm

    At least Smoak draws walks. I have to give him a piece of credit for that.

  30. Kazinski on May 11th, 2013 7:39 pm

    Considering the sheer dearth of quality in American League third basemen, Seager IMO has a shot.

    Cabrera? Longoria? Machado?

    I’m thrilled that Seager has turned into the 4th best 3rd baseman in the AL, but hes not getting selected unless something drastic happens between now and the last week in June.

  31. Westside guy on May 11th, 2013 7:40 pm

    Yeah we were all crazy about Casey Kotchman’s skill set as well.

    /snark

  32. Kazinski on May 11th, 2013 7:44 pm

    I’m not crazy about Shoppach, but I’m crazy about that he’s not Miguel Olivo.

  33. Kazinski on May 11th, 2013 7:45 pm

    right on cue.

    no no hitter, no shutout.

  34. stevemotivateir on May 11th, 2013 7:48 pm

    First hit for the Mariners and it’s a HR in the 5th.

  35. Westside guy on May 11th, 2013 7:49 pm

    Hey, Shop Vac!

    Actually Kelly Shoppach historically has been rather worse than what we’ve seen this year – that’s what a .400 BABIP will do for you…

  36. juneau_fan on May 11th, 2013 7:53 pm

    I really hate when the team claws back into it and the pitcher comes in and give up a run.

  37. Westside guy on May 11th, 2013 7:54 pm

    What’s the deal with Vernon Wells? What he’s done is like if Chone Figgins went to a team and started playing amazing baseball.

  38. MrZDevotee on May 11th, 2013 7:58 pm

    Yeah but Westy-
    We DESERVE at least 2 or 3 guys with a .400+ BABIP. Mariner’s fans should get to enjoy that every few years.

    So I’ll take it. Versus the .150 BA guys…

    PS- Radio broadcast just said opponents are batting .528 the 3rd time thru the lineup against Parker. Let’s do this.

  39. Westside guy on May 11th, 2013 8:00 pm

    Nice play by Cespedes, dammit!

  40. TomC on May 11th, 2013 8:01 pm

    I am at the game and that catch by Cespedes was impressive.

  41. Kazinski on May 11th, 2013 8:02 pm

    it looks like the Mariners are starting to tee off on Parker, and 2 runs is not a huge lead.

  42. Westside guy on May 11th, 2013 8:02 pm

    Shoppach isn’t awful, MrZ – I wasn’t meaning to imply that. Definitely better than Olivo!

  43. juneau_fan on May 11th, 2013 8:02 pm

    Well, shit. It’s that big glove of Cepsedes.

    I dunno. I’ve always like Vernon Wells. If you gotta pick off the trash heap, I would have pulled him out from under the decomposing corpse of Raul.

  44. MrZDevotee on May 11th, 2013 8:04 pm

    Westy-
    Oh no, I wasn’t thinking that, either, was just thinking it’s ABOUT TIME we had someone with an unusually high BABIP rather than the flip side. Let’s ride it while it exists…

    Poor Ackley has been robbed pretty much nightly… And Seager’s blast there was ridiculous…

  45. Woodcutta on May 11th, 2013 8:12 pm

    Does anyone know how available Roger Bernadina is? IMO, he just needs to get extended playing time without having to worry about being sent down if he isn’t an instant success.

  46. juneau_fan on May 11th, 2013 8:14 pm

    Well, shit, part 2.

  47. stevemotivateir on May 11th, 2013 8:15 pm

    How do you, as a GM, seriously think you’re going to improve your offense with a 40+ year old veteran with alarming splits from the year before, another guy coming off three terrible years, and by swapping your best hitter from a year ago for an injury-prone guy you already ditched once?

    Not to knock on Morse, I actually like him. Just don’t like the price we paid, or that he’s used as a regular outfielder.

  48. juneau_fan on May 11th, 2013 8:16 pm

    They need a homerun to score with these two on base.

  49. Kazinski on May 11th, 2013 8:17 pm

    If Wedge doesn’t pinch run for Ibanez here he should be fired. Andino would be perfect, but he is probably saving him to pinch hit for Shoppach.

    They’ve got Romero playing LF in Tacoma tonight, and he homered.

  50. juneau_fan on May 11th, 2013 8:19 pm

    Argh, the lead runner needs to be fast, not the guy after Smoak!

  51. juneau_fan on May 11th, 2013 8:21 pm

    I was having a flashback to Smoak being thrown out at home there–

  52. TomC on May 11th, 2013 8:22 pm

    Smoak runs sloowwww

  53. Liam on May 11th, 2013 8:22 pm

    Looks like Shoppach made his own mark of linear motion.

  54. G-Man on May 11th, 2013 8:23 pm

    I was looking up Dustins splits this year

    .192 .222 .192 vs. LHP
    Why the heck didn’t Endy get to 3rd??

  55. stevemotivateir on May 11th, 2013 8:23 pm

    Rainiers scored 14 runs on 14 hits tonight. Franklin, playing 2B tonight, was 1 for 2 with 3 BB’s. Everyone had at least 1 hit.

  56. HighlightsAt11 on May 11th, 2013 8:23 pm

    I like it when the M’s are able to plate a RISP vs GIDP

  57. juneau_fan on May 11th, 2013 8:24 pm

    The crowd roars when Ryan’s being pinch-hit for.

  58. juneau_fan on May 11th, 2013 8:25 pm

    Ryan could have done that–weak-ground out to short.

  59. Kazinski on May 11th, 2013 8:27 pm

    I’d leave Bay in instead of Chavez, he’s likely to get one more AB. But that will leave Andino hitting 6th, which is not ideal.

    Why the heck didn’t Endy get to 3rd??

    He had to put on the breaks in case Smoak held up at 3rd.

  60. Woodcutta on May 11th, 2013 8:47 pm

    Why did Morales swing at that pitch?

  61. Woodcutta on May 11th, 2013 8:48 pm

    Well, he made up for swinging at ball four.

  62. juneau_fan on May 11th, 2013 8:52 pm

    For the love of a damn flyball…

  63. Kazinski on May 11th, 2013 8:53 pm

    I actually have more confidence right now in Smoak than Morse, but it makes it a lot tougher with two outs.

  64. Sports on a Shtick on May 11th, 2013 8:54 pm

    All right Endy, lean into one!

  65. juneau_fan on May 11th, 2013 8:55 pm

    And the fact that the team has to pinchrun for its old hitters leads to the benchplayer being up at this important juncture. Wouldn’t it just be better to have young, strong players?

  66. Woodcutta on May 11th, 2013 8:56 pm

    How many hanging sliders in Cook going to get away with?

  67. HighlightsAt11 on May 11th, 2013 8:56 pm

    May has been unkind to Morse (BA .143). Or should it be said Morse has been unkind to May?

  68. californiamariner on May 11th, 2013 8:57 pm

    Ugh

  69. juneau_fan on May 11th, 2013 8:58 pm

    Apparently as many as he can throw, Woodcutta.

  70. MrZDevotee on May 11th, 2013 8:58 pm

    Juneau-
    “young, strong players…”

    What are these strange things? I’ve never seen such a thing.

  71. HighlightsAt11 on May 11th, 2013 8:59 pm

    Use your all-purpose utility man to pinch hit for Endy there. Oh I forgot, the M’s don’t have one.

  72. Kazinski on May 11th, 2013 9:01 pm

    Defense is overrated.

  73. juneau_fan on May 11th, 2013 9:01 pm

    Well, at least that was a pay-off for pulling Raul!

  74. juneau_fan on May 11th, 2013 9:03 pm

    There’s something about Capps that just make me laugh.

  75. Woodcutta on May 11th, 2013 9:04 pm

    Rizz blew that send off.

  76. HighlightsAt11 on May 11th, 2013 9:08 pm

    Montero to pitch hit for Drano….please.

  77. HighlightsAt11 on May 11th, 2013 9:12 pm

    If it goes extra innings, Montero couldn’t play any worse at short than he does playing catcher.

  78. Kazinski on May 11th, 2013 9:12 pm

    Ackley needs to take a page out of Saunders book and be more aggressive swinging at balls in the zone. His Zswing% is only 54%, and that 90% in the zone contact rate doesn’t help him if he doesn’t swing more.

    Taking so many pitches isn’t helping his walk rate at all, he’s only walking at a 4% rate, so he needs to take his chances putting the ball in play.

  79. msfanmike on May 11th, 2013 9:13 pm

    Ackley takes good, hittable pitches and then gets painted low and away on a pitch that nobody – especially him – can do anything with. He watches 3 strikes in the 9th with his team down a run. How is that possible … what is he waiting for in that situation?

  80. juneau_fan on May 11th, 2013 9:14 pm

    I was gonna say, who plays short? Move Seager over and put Morales at 3rd and Montero at first?

    Oh, it doesn’t matter. *groan*

  81. G-Man on May 11th, 2013 9:14 pm

    Why not Montero PH for Shoppach?

    Well, Kelly did go yard and is faster.

    pinch run with a pitcher? No not in MLB these days.

  82. tdhseattle on May 11th, 2013 9:14 pm

    Are the Mariners TRYING to lose? Why is Andino in? Pinch hit!

  83. Ralph_Malph on May 11th, 2013 9:15 pm

    If you hit for Andino and tie it, Morse plays SS, of course.

  84. G-Man on May 11th, 2013 9:15 pm

    Didn’t Andino hit a GWHR against the M’s last year?

    Never mind.

  85. juneau_fan on May 11th, 2013 9:15 pm

    Need a like button for that one, Ralph_Malph.

  86. MrZDevotee on May 11th, 2013 9:15 pm

    Saunders walk off… Calling it.

  87. Woodcutta on May 11th, 2013 9:16 pm

    It isn’t all Ackley’s fault. He gets a much larger percentage of pitches on the corner or just off the corner called for strikes than I’ve ever seen anyone get called. I don’t know if umpires just don’t like him but he seems to get squeezed almost every at bat.

  88. Kazinski on May 11th, 2013 9:16 pm

    Morse would play 3rd, Seagar would play short.

    I’d risk that for a few innings, for a chance to tie it up.

  89. G-Man on May 11th, 2013 9:17 pm

    Ralph, good point.

  90. tdhseattle on May 11th, 2013 9:18 pm

    Game time now. go saunders

  91. Woodcutta on May 11th, 2013 9:18 pm

    Wow, Balfour hasn’t thrown a pitch over the plate to Saunders and it is a 2-2 count.

  92. tdhseattle on May 11th, 2013 9:19 pm

    COMEON SEAGER! It’s up 2 u

  93. MrZDevotee on May 11th, 2013 9:19 pm

    Michael Saunders keeps it alive… Calling it.

  94. juneau_fan on May 11th, 2013 9:20 pm

    Gods, it’s been so long since I’ve heard that ‘rah-rah’ song in the 9th!

  95. tdhseattle on May 11th, 2013 9:21 pm

    2-0 pitch to hit

  96. HighlightsAt11 on May 11th, 2013 9:21 pm

    Kyle…walk-off…calling it.

  97. msfanmike on May 11th, 2013 9:22 pm

    It isn’t Ackley’s fault that Ackley doesn’t swing at enough strikes?

    Huh, its a conspiracy. Who knew.

  98. juneau_fan on May 11th, 2013 9:22 pm

    Uh…Strike? Really, Umpire Man?

  99. tdhseattle on May 11th, 2013 9:22 pm

    omg I’m gonna vommit

  100. Woodcutta on May 11th, 2013 9:23 pm

    How does a pitcher throw 10 straight pitches out of the strike zone, yet still gets three of them called a strike.

  101. Sports on a Shtick on May 11th, 2013 9:24 pm

    Opportunities missed. That’s the story of the game. Oh well.

    Saunders continues to impress. Everything about his game is solid.

  102. juneau_fan on May 11th, 2013 9:24 pm

    Way to give the game to A’s. Guess the ump wanted to get to his barstool, like now.

  103. californiamariner on May 11th, 2013 9:25 pm

    Stranded 7 runners those last 3 innings. Shoppach should have been on 2nd when Saunders got the hit. Or maybe if we didn’t have a horribly constructed roster a pinch runner would have been used for Shoppach and he, being a good runner, would have done the job. Sure, maybe Saunders at bat goes differently with a guy on 2nd but it gets really old seeing a handicapped roster in late close ball games.

  104. Woodcutta on May 11th, 2013 9:27 pm

    It isn’t Ackley’s fault he gets squeezed in almost every at bat. There were four or five times in the second half of last season where the ump called strike three when the ball was at least 3-4 inches off of the plate to end the game. I’d agree that he needs to realize what is happening to him and start being more aggressive but it isn’t like he’s not swinging at pitches out over the plate.

  105. pdome01 on May 11th, 2013 9:42 pm

    How about a Bunt? Isn’t there some sort of statistic that more guys score from second on a line drive base hit than from first?

  106. evolvingcaveman on May 11th, 2013 9:42 pm

    Losing Jaso still isn’t the problem.

    Jaso- .255/.339/.663 4dbl’s 1 hr
    Shoppach .264/.371/.843 5dbl’s 2 hr.

    The Morse/Kendrys additions aren’t the problem. The problem is once again the lack of anything at all out of Ackley/Smoak/Montero in 2013. The young guys don’t step up, we lose. All year. All next year. Forever. Maybe we eventually become the 1st team to add 7 position players via free-agency and hit it big.

  107. absolutsyd on May 11th, 2013 10:30 pm

    You have to pinch hit for Andino there. God dam it. Yes it means that you have a shit defense on the field if you tie (never mind that you fucking start Raul so obviously you don’t care about defense). It is better to go the extras with a shit defense than to lose in 9. If you don’t understand that, you have no business managing an MLB team, or announcing or talking on the radio after games. It’s that fucking simple.

  108. Kazinski on May 11th, 2013 10:35 pm

    The problem is once again the lack of anything at all out of Ackley/Smoak/Montero in 2013.

    Quit looking for scapegoats, Ackley had a hit and drove in a run tonight, and Smoak had a hit and walked twice and scored two runs. Montero didn’t play.

    If you wanted to point fingers you could point at Morse, but that wouldn’t fit the narrative.

    The Mariners are getting better this year but the progress is coming slowly. If someone told me at the beginning of the season we’d be 1 1/2 games out of 2nd place in the middle of May, and hadn’t lost a series in three weeks I would take that. Especially with Saunders and Gutierrez having stints on the DL, and Morse breaking a finger.

  109. stevemotivateir on May 12th, 2013 8:34 am

    Adding to Kazinski’s rebuttal, losing Jaso certainly didn’t help and it’s worth noting we needed another catcher regardless. If you’re going to compare Jaso’s line to anyone, it should be Morse.

    But there’s more to it than that. Jaso still has a great OBP, even after tonight. He also has 10 RBI’s hitting in the top of the order and in a platoon role. Shoppach had 5 RBI’s coming into the game. Morse has 15, but with a .278 OBP.

    It’s a collective problem the M’s have. Losing key players, not getting enough out of a few others, lack of production from some of the new faces….. it all adds up. Poor roster construction leads to poor results.

    Having said that, I’m actually surprised we’re not further back than what we are.

  110. evolvingcaveman on May 12th, 2013 8:47 am

    I’m not speaking about tonights game in particular. People mention we’d be better with Bourn/Swisher on our team since they are playing well, instead of the Morse/Morales type set-up JackZ gave us. No matter who you bring in the “young guys” will determine our future level of success. We need them to improve and I watch every game rooting for it, not against it.
    Comparing Jaso to Shoppach is reasonable, but to be fair I’d have to compare Morse to whoever they’d have in the OF you’re right.

  111. Westside guy on May 12th, 2013 9:25 am

    It’s funny how people initially thought Morse was the Mariner Messiah, and now he’s a scapegoat. But really, the blame should be the team’s – he probably should’ve gone on the DL when he broke his finger, but thanks to the 2013 roster construction they didn’t (or couldn’t) do that.

    His true talent level is actually much closer to the guy he’s been, overall, so far than to the guy who was homering every game – but a career .841 OPS is pretty decent (Seager’s 2013 OPS is .826). He is what he is – a strong guy with injury issues who doesn’t get on-base enough to be a great hitter. He’s still a good hitter; but all those people (like GB) who saw six home runs in six days and proclaimed what a lopsided trade that was and how bemoaning the loss of Jaso was laughable are now hopefully learning the definition of “perspective”.

    P.S. Condor’s OPS so far in 2013 has been .874.

  112. stevemotivateir on May 12th, 2013 10:16 am

    Well said, Westy.

    @evolvingcaveman

    I don’t think anyone here is routing against any of our players. And the point is that everyone, not just younger players (I’d argue that Smoak isn’t young anymore), need to step it up.

    Morse and Morales are good hitters. The Mariners needed good hitters. But they also needed good outfielders. Jack didn’t do that, and none of these guys likely figure into the long term plan, which is important to take note of, because there’s very little outfield talent/depth in the system.

    The young infielders, catchers, and pitchers will factor heavily into the team’s success in the future. But it’s likely going to be veterans we’ll depend on for outfield production. Maybe we’ll get lucky with Romero, but Morse shouldn’t be a starting outfielder, which leaves us with just Saunders as things sit for next season. Gutierrez isn’t likely coming back, unless it’s an incentive-laced deal, and even then, it’s not like he can be counted on to start regularly.

    This team really needed guys like Swisher and Bourn. It would have (potentially) solved two problems for several years or longer. Instead, we got Bay, Ibanez, Morse, and Morales for one year. Maybe Morse will get re-signed, but he should be at DH or 1B, and we’ll still be right back where we started this offseason with less options available.

    So what then? Trade? Overpay for someone like Ellsbury? I would have preferred they dealt with the issue last offseason. If they were willing to shell-out for Hamilton, they should have been willing to pay a little more for TWO players that could have made things a lot better and easier. The fact that those two both landed in Cleveland on reasonable contracts says a lot about their availability.

    Maybe some people have eased-off with their anger/frustration directed at Eric and Jack, but I haven’t. Regardless of how close we are or get to .500, this offseason was ridiculous and those two haven’t done anything to convince me they’re competent for the jobs they hold.

    This is not a team that screams “We’re close to competing!”. I’ll cheer them on and hope for the best, but I won’t be placing money on them.

  113. evolvingcaveman on May 12th, 2013 12:20 pm

    Good comment and I do agree with you 95%. Swisher and Bourn were obvious needs that the front office didn’t make happen and set us up to be where we are at now(terrible OF). I didn’t mind Morse as much as others with Guti and Saunders beside him and thought Kendrys would help at 1b/dh. I didn’t have the problem with the 1year deals since to me it felt as if we were in the last stages of figuring out who our core group was going to be going forward and could add some help around those holes later. Basically, I was relying on some improvement as it appears JackZ was. I don’t think it’s possible to fill all our needs through free-agency and keep coming back to the realization that our young players/prospects have to step up and produce.
    Keeping all the others in place I’m curious how many games better you would see us being with bourn/swisher/jaso rather than morse/kendrys/shoppach. Feels like a couple more maybe. Is there a straight sabermetric answer that gets us close? I’m trying to evolve I swear.
    A better slash line from ackley/monetro/smoak(I’m thinking a plain .260+ avg)on the other hand adds up to a much bigger impovement, perhaps 5-6 more wins in my pea brain. Maybe that’s just the irrational leftover from the bases loaded failure we’ve seen. I’m still hopeful that JackZ is the right guy but I’m over Wedge.

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